Brown Jenkin
First Post
Veni, vidi, vici
Rome seems to sum up D&D quite sucinctly.
Rome seems to sum up D&D quite sucinctly.
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Greece vs. Rome: Which is better for a Campaign?
- Thread starter Wik
- Start date
Wombat
First Post
My general feeling is Greece.
Reasons? First of all, smaller states (heck, you can always add another one -- you can have a hundred kings running around at once!), a "built in" player mentality (think of Jason & the Argonauts, the Odyssey, and the attempts to build Magna Graecia), and the fun of weirdly mixing cultures if you bump over into the Hellenistic era -- Persia, Judea, Egypt and all the rest at your fingertips, even the Indus River Valley!
On top of this, the notion of gods meddling all the time and weirdly powerful and dangerous magical items, as well as deadly creatures, feel endemic
I have always wondered why more rpgs were not set in the ancient world, as opposed to the pseudo-Middle Ages...
Reasons? First of all, smaller states (heck, you can always add another one -- you can have a hundred kings running around at once!), a "built in" player mentality (think of Jason & the Argonauts, the Odyssey, and the attempts to build Magna Graecia), and the fun of weirdly mixing cultures if you bump over into the Hellenistic era -- Persia, Judea, Egypt and all the rest at your fingertips, even the Indus River Valley!
On top of this, the notion of gods meddling all the time and weirdly powerful and dangerous magical items, as well as deadly creatures, feel endemic
I have always wondered why more rpgs were not set in the ancient world, as opposed to the pseudo-Middle Ages...
Scribble
First Post
I'd go with Greece if it was an either or thing. 
I think the Greek philosophy seems to fit more with many of the current concept in teh game.
The greek "hero" for instance seems (to me at least) to be a lot like the idea of "hero" in D&D. Someone not nessisarily selfless and helpful, but someone "favored by the gods" and above the common person..
I think the Greek philosophy seems to fit more with many of the current concept in teh game.
The greek "hero" for instance seems (to me at least) to be a lot like the idea of "hero" in D&D. Someone not nessisarily selfless and helpful, but someone "favored by the gods" and above the common person..
In generally, I recommend staying away from any Greco-Roman Imperial setting outside of the collapse periods of the Roman and Byzantine Empires, unless you want to run a very urban game with a lot of political plots. If you are going to do political machinations and games of Empire, though, you couldn't pick a much better setting!
You've got a lot more room to work with in terms of wilderness and "dark places" if you stick to the early roman republic or the early city-states era of Greece. You're closer to each civilization's mythical period and you'll see fewer instances of strong central authorities overshadowing heroic opportunities and fantastic threats.
Basically, once you hit Scipio or Phillip in either civilization's time-line I think you've crossed the line from a more wilderness-friendly setting to a more politics-friendly setting.
- Marty Lund
You've got a lot more room to work with in terms of wilderness and "dark places" if you stick to the early roman republic or the early city-states era of Greece. You're closer to each civilization's mythical period and you'll see fewer instances of strong central authorities overshadowing heroic opportunities and fantastic threats.
Basically, once you hit Scipio or Phillip in either civilization's time-line I think you've crossed the line from a more wilderness-friendly setting to a more politics-friendly setting.
- Marty Lund
I'd say Greece, largely because of my fondness for Greek myth, and because I think the city-state system works better for an RPG - easier to have a a lot of diversity without having to go on a continent-spanning trek.
On the other hand, something like Jim Butcher's Furies of Calderon provides a pretty good blueprint for a fantasy RPG set in a Rome-like world.
On the other hand, something like Jim Butcher's Furies of Calderon provides a pretty good blueprint for a fantasy RPG set in a Rome-like world.
Lanefan
Victoria Rules
All true if your campaign takes place "close to home", so to speak; but both the Greek and Roman empires had borderlands, and that's where all the fun is...unless, as you say, one seeks deep political intrigue.
Conversely, one could reverse it...set the game up such that the Greeks or Romans are the enemies. Would probably work best if the empire is either expanding or contracting in a big way, though; stability here would be hard to work with over the long term.
And yeah, Xena all the way when it comes to mixing cultures from different times in the same world. There's always going to be Norse, and Celts, and early-Renaissance Brits, and so forth...
Lanefan
Darrin Drader
Explorer
The only thing that would make one better than the other in terms of rules would be technology. Greece was bronze age. Rome had steel. This is a big deal.
Aside from that, my preference would be Greece. In Greece, you literally have all of the foundations for modern society: early democracy (bear in mind that only landed nobles got a vote), a rich polytheistic mythology, great science and philosophy, and contact with Mesopotamia, Egypt, and the near east.
Rome was kind of the transition point where all the cool things from the ancient world became the sucky things of the modern world. I won't elaborate in order to avoid giving offense. Basically, in my mind, Greece is more D&D than Rome, and it is more D&D than the middle ages.
I do have to agree with this. Furies of Calderon does take a setting very inspired by Rome and make it into something that is workable within the genre.
Aside from that, my preference would be Greece. In Greece, you literally have all of the foundations for modern society: early democracy (bear in mind that only landed nobles got a vote), a rich polytheistic mythology, great science and philosophy, and contact with Mesopotamia, Egypt, and the near east.
Rome was kind of the transition point where all the cool things from the ancient world became the sucky things of the modern world. I won't elaborate in order to avoid giving offense. Basically, in my mind, Greece is more D&D than Rome, and it is more D&D than the middle ages.
I do have to agree with this. Furies of Calderon does take a setting very inspired by Rome and make it into something that is workable within the genre.
Angel Tarragon
Dawn Dragon
If it helps, Green Ronin has a supplement called Eternal Rome.
SHARK
First Post
Greetings!
Hmmm. Well, to be honest, neither one is necessarily "better" than the other, as far as campaign settings go. Both Ancient Greece, and Ancient Rome can readily accomodate the exact same campaign elements--each particular setting however, does it in a different way. That particular way will simply be preferable based on how the DM wants to go about running the campaign, and what areas and styles to emphasize.
Ancient Greece:
Whether you are running a campaign set from the ancient Dorian barbarian invasions and the destruction of Mycenae, to the storming of the walls of Troy, or the great Pelloponesian War, the various conflicts between the city-states of Sparta, Athens, among others, to Alexander The Great's sacking of Persepolis and the annihilation of the world's largest and most powerful army, that of the Persian Empire, and the subsequent march to the great Indus River, and the reaches of the jungles of India, and even to the wars of the Successor States--Ptolomy, Seluicid, and so on provide plenty of exotic cities, vast deserts, political intrigue, seduction, palaces full of women, slaves, assassins, royal marriages, espionage, and glorious treasures to keep a campaign going for years.
Of course, Ancient Greece, as well as the periods stretching through Classical Greece, to the Hellenistic Age, offers outstanding exploration milieu's, gods and demi-gods, great cities, ferocious monsters and wondrous adventure.
Ancient Rome:
Ancient Rome, offers everything virtually that Ancient Greece offers, simply through different style and method of delivery. Ancient Rome, from the early days of foundation, all the way through to the republican years of Marius, offers savage frontiers of barbarian invasions, monsters on the frontiers, and lots of city adventures, politics, and intrigue.
Shifting a bit in focus, to the time of Caesar, well, again, scope for city intrigues, gladiatorial games, circus races, barbarian invasions, monsters on the frontiers, rebellions, assassination plots, and glorious armies marching to years and years of bloody war, glorious conquest, and empire building seldom seen in scale through all of history.
Periods later on in Ancient Rome--whether focusing on the period of Imperial Acsension, the time of the Five Good Emperors, or imperial decline, the era of Imperial Resurgence under Diocletian, Justinian, among others, until the fading years of the empire's glory when corruption, war, among other changes had sapped the Roman Empire's ability to heal and regenerate itself, and ultimately to rise again to a period of glory and dominance.
Generally speaking, both campaign settings offer vast scope for the same kinds of adventures. Whether urban based, wilderness or frontier-based, army-focused, political/intrigue, exploration/discovery--both settings can do it all, and in spades. Ancient Rome simply offers a bit higher in the technological aspect of things, a tighter political environment, and a bigger campaign scope.
Semper Fidelis,
SHARK
Hmmm. Well, to be honest, neither one is necessarily "better" than the other, as far as campaign settings go. Both Ancient Greece, and Ancient Rome can readily accomodate the exact same campaign elements--each particular setting however, does it in a different way. That particular way will simply be preferable based on how the DM wants to go about running the campaign, and what areas and styles to emphasize.
Ancient Greece:
Whether you are running a campaign set from the ancient Dorian barbarian invasions and the destruction of Mycenae, to the storming of the walls of Troy, or the great Pelloponesian War, the various conflicts between the city-states of Sparta, Athens, among others, to Alexander The Great's sacking of Persepolis and the annihilation of the world's largest and most powerful army, that of the Persian Empire, and the subsequent march to the great Indus River, and the reaches of the jungles of India, and even to the wars of the Successor States--Ptolomy, Seluicid, and so on provide plenty of exotic cities, vast deserts, political intrigue, seduction, palaces full of women, slaves, assassins, royal marriages, espionage, and glorious treasures to keep a campaign going for years.
Of course, Ancient Greece, as well as the periods stretching through Classical Greece, to the Hellenistic Age, offers outstanding exploration milieu's, gods and demi-gods, great cities, ferocious monsters and wondrous adventure.
Ancient Rome:
Ancient Rome, offers everything virtually that Ancient Greece offers, simply through different style and method of delivery. Ancient Rome, from the early days of foundation, all the way through to the republican years of Marius, offers savage frontiers of barbarian invasions, monsters on the frontiers, and lots of city adventures, politics, and intrigue.
Shifting a bit in focus, to the time of Caesar, well, again, scope for city intrigues, gladiatorial games, circus races, barbarian invasions, monsters on the frontiers, rebellions, assassination plots, and glorious armies marching to years and years of bloody war, glorious conquest, and empire building seldom seen in scale through all of history.
Periods later on in Ancient Rome--whether focusing on the period of Imperial Acsension, the time of the Five Good Emperors, or imperial decline, the era of Imperial Resurgence under Diocletian, Justinian, among others, until the fading years of the empire's glory when corruption, war, among other changes had sapped the Roman Empire's ability to heal and regenerate itself, and ultimately to rise again to a period of glory and dominance.
Generally speaking, both campaign settings offer vast scope for the same kinds of adventures. Whether urban based, wilderness or frontier-based, army-focused, political/intrigue, exploration/discovery--both settings can do it all, and in spades. Ancient Rome simply offers a bit higher in the technological aspect of things, a tighter political environment, and a bigger campaign scope.
Semper Fidelis,
SHARK
