Another Cease and Desist Letter: 4E Powercards

[El Mahdi]

The OGL spoiled us all big time. I may sound harsh in saying this, but consumers are nothing better than greedy brats; get them used to free ice cream and when you actually tell them they have to pay for your new cone they will throw a tantrum. It is an ugly generalization, but it holds more than a grain of truth.

Nuh-uh! Does Not! Pthhhhhhhht!

 

[Imaro]

The OGL spoiled as all big time. I may sound harsh in saying this, but consumers are nothing better than greedy brats; get them used to free ice cream and when you actually tell them they have to pay for your new cone they will throw a tantrum. It is an ugly generalization, but it holds more than a grain of truth.

I feel like we've been spoiled by the 3e SRD. Why else would we think that copying big chunks out of a copyrighted book and making it available for free on the web is acceptable?

I'm not going to address the rest of these two posts but I did want to talk about this whole "spoiled" by the SRD thing. I think perhaps the draconian practices of TSR and the subsequent SRD may have put things in a slightly skewed light.

IME, most rpg's other than D&D that I play have tons of this type of stuff on the internet and aren't making the fans who created it take it down (hell, some of it is offered by the actual company for free.). Just a few off-hand I know about are... Exalted, it has charm cards out there...Star Wars SE has company made and fan made force cards on the internet... Contract Cards for Changeling and... you know what never mind. I guess in the end either you support a companies practices because they are what you agree with or you don't. But please this "spoiled brat" line of reasoning is insulting when it really has nothing to do with the SRD and everything with the value particular companies offer those who choose to support their products.

Here's a link where WW has all of it's Solar Exalted charm cards for download...free.

White Wolf Downloads

And here's a fan's blog who created and posted links to contract cards for Changeling the Lost... he even posted their location on White Wolf's forum...

Seeming Contracts and Goblin Contracts « Relborn’s Fantasy Blog

Hey, even WotC get's in on the action when its not D&D...

Force Power Cards

and fans have filled in the new ones from the released sourcebooks without C&D letters going out.

Also there's Mongoose Publishing that has gone the OGL route...with it's own SRD...

Main Page - MRQWiki

Perhaps it's not so much being spoiled as the fact that the value expected when one supports a game has changed both in the view of the consumer as well as in the view of many companies... and perhaps WotC needs to realize this. I'm not saying eveything should be free, but there are certain expectations (you know like a decent character sheet) that help facilitate gameplay and are not charged for by many game companies or C&D letters sent out, though most fan sheets I've seen use the D&D logo, name, etc.). I don't think it's being "spoiled" to expect this from the industry leader when everyone around them appears to be doing it.

 

[billd91]

Perhaps it's not so much being spoiled as the fact that the value expected when one supports a game has changed both in the view of the consumer as well as in the view of many companies... and perhaps WotC needs to realize this. I'm not saying eveything should be free, but there are certain expectations (you know like a decent character sheet) that help facilitate gameplay and are not charged for by many game companies or C&D letters sent out, though most fan sheets I've seen use the D&D logo, name, etc.). I don't think it's being "spoiled" to expect this from the industry leader when everyone around them appears to be doing it.

I think it's worth pointing out that these other game companies are swimming in different waters, as far as markets and market power, than WotC. I think a lot of smaller companies are willing to invest the effort in these offerings and risk the loss of potential revenue because it (or at least forego a likely paltry revenue stream) saves them in marketing expenses. I suspect it serves as efficient and cheap marketing on their part. They need that community service to keep or expand their niche among niches market.

WotC, with the biggest game titles in market and media share and as part of the Hasbro conglomerate, has the resources to run broader marketing and actually has the a ghost of a chance to turn something like character sheets or power cards into a revenue-generating product. So they do.

 

[joethelawyer]

Let me preface this by saying that I am not an Intellectual Property lawyer, and most of my IP knowledge is from back in '94 when I was in lawschool, ranting and raving against TSR on Usenet. So don't anyone take this as legal advice, please.

Also, I barely know 4e, I don't know what Powers and Power Cards are, and most importantly, I never saw the site in question.

Now that it's been established that I have absolutely no basis for a legal opinion of any kind on the matter, here's my personal non-lawyerish opinion.

It sounds like the guy had copyrighted material on the site, and WOTC had a right to take it down.

It seems like, according to Scott R., someone could put up a power card with fan designed material in it on a website. Since a Power seems to be a new part of 4e, able to be licensed under the GSL, then under the current GSL, as I understand it, that right to publish it can be taken away on a whim. It also seems that in the absence of a fansite policy, in order to protect your ass when it comes to publishing a Power Card on your webpage using the template, you may need to sign the GSL. That seems to be the cautionary implication I get from Scott R.'s posts in this thread.

Since there is no fansite policy in place, I would suggest everyone take the recent C&D letters as a warning. Though the material in question in these last couple enforcement actions seems to have been wrongfully published, in that copyrighted material was published, in one case for money and in one case for free, it is an indication that WOTC is not messing around when it comes to perceived copyright violations.

Can a person put up something vaguely in the shape of a Power Card and call it something else, and post what are essentially powers on the card? Yes. Will WOTC try to do something about it? Who knows. You can be fairly certain that if they do, they'll threaten the hosting company, and the company will shut the site down if the owner of the site doesn't.

That's just the way it works. I have found that the law is usually less about what is legal, and more about those with power doing what they like through the law against those without power.

No one wants the hassle and expense of a lawsuit. I've done stuff like what WOTC is doing myself. A client of mine had a book published which had what could be considered defamatory comments on a website about the book and author, beyond just your typical "this book sucked." So I sent them a "I JoetheLawyer will sue your ass in Federal Court unless you take down all bad comments about this book" letter, and within a week the offending comments were removed. The website was Amazon.com. They had the power and money to fight i if they so choset. Most small website hosting companies don't. What do you think the small companies will do? The same thing they did in the early 90's when TSR started their clampdown.

My opinion, as I have been stating for months now, is that one of the motivations for such a radical change from 3.x to 4e in terms of terminology was so that WOTC could do just this: Clamp down on anything which in their opinion may cut into their sales. They wanted to undo the
OGL as much as they possibly could. Hence Powers, Bloodied, and all the other new terminology and changes which seem to be changes mostly for the sake of the change. They want to take back more of the market.

Call me cynical, but I don't think the ridiculous delay of the revised GSL was unintentional either. It's just good business to do so. Bad PR, but they may be of the opinion that they can spin that bad PR away.

I do remember Scott R. saying recently in a post that he was investigating websites for IP violations. I thnk that post was in response to a "Where's the new GSL?" post. I think that's a fairly good indication of where WOTC's priorities are these days, and perhaps a glimpse into the future. We'll see in a few years where we're at.

I don't blame Necro Games and others for taking a cautionary approach to publishing for 4e. Who knows, the revised GSL may adress their concerns. Judging by how long it is taking to get revised GSL though, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for a fansite policy.

Anyhow, I'm typed out on the matter. All I have to say is thank god for Pathfinder and all the other OGL-based games out there. Because of the OGL we will never be in a situation many of us remember from the early 90's with TSR.

Since I don't like 4e anyhow, call me self-centered, but I don't give a damn what WOTC does these days. As far as I see it, these sorts of aggressive enforcement tactics, delays in licenses, and bad PR moves all push gamers away from 4e and into systems that I play, increasing the relative power and marketshare of those game systems and their players.

 

[mxyzplk]

Perhaps it's not so much being spoiled as the fact that the value expected when one supports a game has changed both in the view of the consumer as well as in the view of many companies... and perhaps WotC needs to realize this. I'm not saying eveything should be free, but there are certain expectations (you know like a decent character sheet) that help facilitate gameplay and are not charged for by many game companies or C&D letters sent out, though most fan sheets I've seen use the D&D logo, name, etc.). I don't think it's being "spoiled" to expect this from the industry leader when everyone around them appears to be doing it.

This is my problem with it. Wizards wants fansites to exist and spread D&D. "Oh, we love ENWorld and these other fansites," they say. It's pretty hard to do that without running afoul of IP law; between copyright and trademark there's a lot to "violate." Put up a writeup of your spiffy new fighter and actually include a power description, and you're "just cutting and pasting Wizards IP." Especially on community sites like this, there's a lot of opportunity for random folks to post stuff that has Wizards IP (see the ENWorld Downloads section for evidence).

They want to close sites they don't like, though. The fair thing to do for the community would be to actually publish these fabled fansite guidelines. Rouse keeps saying that they're just not high priority. So treating your customers fairly isn't high priority? Especially your lead customers who put time and effort into promoting and developing your game? I find it entertaining seeing so many people excuse and celebrate Wizards' contempt for them.

 

[Imaro]

I think it's worth pointing out that these other game companies are swimming in different waters, as far as markets and market power, than WotC. I think a lot of smaller companies are willing to invest the effort in these offerings and risk the loss of potential revenue because it (or at least forego a likely paltry revenue stream) saves them in marketing expenses. I suspect it serves as efficient and cheap marketing on their part. They need that community service to keep or expand their niche among niches market.

WotC, with the biggest game titles in market and media share and as part of the Hasbro conglomerate, has the resources to run broader marketing and actually has the a ghost of a chance to turn something like character sheets or power cards into a revenue-generating product. So they do.

Oh, I understand that... I was just making the point that it's a little more complex than being "spoiled" by the SRD.

 

[Glyfair]

IME, most rpg's other than D&D that I play have tons of this type of stuff on the internet and aren't making the fans who created it take it down (hell, some of it is offered by the actual company for free.).

So does WotC. There are tons of D&D sites with fan made bits up that they aren't making them take down.

Just a few off-hand I know about are... Exalted, it has charm cards out there...Star Wars SE has company made and fan made force cards on the internet... Contract Cards for Changeling and... you know what never mind.

I am not as aware of the general RPG field out there as I used to be (just not enough time at my age). How many of these are duplicates of products the company either has released or are about to release?

Because if none of them are then it is sort of comparing apples to oranges. It's hard to hold a company up for allowing fans to create tools they have no intention of marketing and then reviling a company for not allowing that when the tools steps on the tools of a product the company is releasing.

 

[I'm A Banana]

This is pretty much exactly the kind of thing the GSL is made to prevent. It's well within WotC's rights to stop this.

It just makes me miss the OGL, personally.

 

[Azgulor]

Its not suprising. WOTC has every right to demand that its copyrighted materials not be distributed free of charge.

The genius part was letting the site operate for as long as it did. Why pay for market research when fans will do it for nothing? The site proved that there is a demand for such cards now WOTC can sell them.

Although my immediate reaction was "Power cards are copyrighted material? THAT'S worthy of a cease-and-desist letter?", WotC is within their rights to protect their IP/copyrighted materials. Petty, IMO, but within their rights.

If you are correct, however, that they took advantage of "free market research" as you've suggested, however, the word that comes to mind starts with "P" and ends with "icks".

I'd prefer to think they just got around to deciding whether or not it was worth bothering with. If that's me with my head in the sand, oh well. But if the GSL is any indication, their legal department ain't exactly speedy, quick, or nimble...

 

[DaveMage]

This is pretty much exactly the kind of thing the GSL is made to prevent. It's well within WotC's rights to stop this.

It just makes me miss the OGL, personally.

Every time I see a thread like this, I invoke a silent "thank you" to Ryan Dancey.