Archlich - the Vecna killer

[baberg]

A just told a friend of mine about the Archlich Epic Destiny from Arcane Power, and he brought up Vecna. I think Vecna is hopeless against an Archlich.

Archlich has Resist 20 Necrotic and an Aura 3 for 5 Radiant against Undead. Vecna has Aura 10 that heals Undead for 50 HP and is Vulnerable 20 Radiant. Vecna's best non-necrotic attack deals 2d10+9, and his best necrotic attack deals 2d8+15.

Given these stats, an Archlich standing next to Vecna will take a maximum of 29 damage each round but be healed for 50, so the Archlich is always topped off. Vecna will take 25 damage from the Archlich's aura. Thus it's only a matter of time until Vecna dies.

The only out I can see is that nowhere does the Archlich Epic Destiny specifically state that the player gains the "Undead" keyword. The fluff says it (twice!) but it doesn't specifically say that they are undead.

Any thoughts?

 

[Mithreinmaethor]

A just told a friend of mine about the Archlich Epic Destiny from Arcane Power, and he brought up Vecna. I think Vecna is hopeless against an Archlich.

Archlich has Resist 20 Necrotic and an Aura 3 for 5 Radiant against Undead. Vecna has Aura 10 that heals Undead for 50 HP and is Vulnerable 20 Radiant. Vecna's best non-necrotic attack deals 2d10+9, and his best necrotic attack deals 2d8+15.

Given these stats, an Archlich standing next to Vecna will take a maximum of 29 damage each round but be healed for 50, so the Archlich is always topped off. Vecna will take 25 damage from the Archlich's aura. Thus it's only a matter of time until Vecna dies.

The only out I can see is that nowhere does the Archlich Epic Destiny specifically state that the player gains the "Undead" keyword. The fluff says it (twice!) but it doesn't specifically say that they are undead.

Any thoughts?

I was reading the Archlich writeup and I have as of yet seen where it gains the Undead trait. So in your above example it would not get the healing from Vecnas aura

 

[baberg]

Yeah, as I said, the only place where the ED says "undead" is in the flavor text. So hopefully it means I could rule that they're not "Undead"-style undead, they're just fleshless.

 

[jaappie]

Can't Vecna stop his aura? Or even better, stop using it on you (not really sure if that is possible). Ofcourse the resist necro and radiant aura is still a huge problem for our one eyed lich.

 

[Ryujin]

It looks good. I'm just wondering what it'll do to our party's soon-to-be Radiant Servant When we eventually reach Epic and I tell him that I'm going Archlich

 

[baberg]

Can't Vecna stop his aura? Or even better, stop using it on you (not really sure if that is possible). Ofcourse the resist necro and radiant aura is still a huge problem for our one eyed lich.

Ah, yes, you're right - under the Aura description, a creature can drop or re-activate its aura as a minor action. Thanks

 

[Mithreinmaethor]

Yeah, as I said, the only place where the ED says "undead" is in the flavor text. So hopefully it means I could rule that they're not "Undead"-style undead, they're just fleshless.

They dont get it because if you read the fluff very early on they were not touched by Orcus etc so do not carry the taint of undeath. So your welcome to take that Archlich and stand next to Vecna if ya wish.

 

[Kinneus]

Even if the Archlich did get the 'Undead' keyword, I think DM adjudication would prevent this from happening. Vecna is the god of undeath; if he wants to exclude you from his aura, you better believe you're going to be excluded from his aura.

 

[DracoSuave]

No, you see, the entire idea is that you're supposed to go up to Vecna and ask him "Hey, pal, I'm undead, but that undead stuff doesn't work on me" and he looks at you with his one eye, extends his hand (his good hand, not his non-hand), and he places his finger against his cheek and says....

...

"You see, that is a secret."

 

[James McMurray]

Worst case scenario: all works as believed and the archlich is truly Vecna's Pimp. I think it's safe to assume that the God of Undead and Secrets will very rapidly figure this out, and then be smart enough not to get in a stand up fight with the guy.

So if anything, having an archlich in the party should make killing Vecna harder, not easier.