monk preview: another expertise feat - talk about stealth errata!

[chaotix42]

Do I want +1 to opportunity attacks from Combat Reflexes, or +1 to all weapon attacks rising to +2 and +3 later from Weapon Expertise? Or, on second thought, maybe +1 to all weapon and implement attacks rising to +2 and +3 later from Focused Expertise?

Delicious choices!

I might choose both.

 

[Nail]

I am still unconvinced that the math requires fixing ..

You've done the math then, I take it.

 

[Amphimir Míriel]

You've done the math then, I take it.

Well, my current experience is that heroic level characters don't need the feat.

This might change when my groups hit paragon or epic.

 

[tiornys]

Well, my current experience is that heroic level characters don't need the feat.

This might change when my groups hit paragon or epic.

My group started noticing the hit-rate decay at high heroic and early paragon. That may be somewhat early since we're typically fighting against +level enemies (and have been since about level 2), but I'd expect it to be noticeable for most groups by mid paragon (assuming the DM doesn't start adjusting the encounters differently).

t~

 

[ForbidenMaster]

You've done the math then, I take it.

I think I have, but if someone wouldnt mind double checking it for errors that would be great:

Average Monster AC = 14+Level
Average PC Attack Bonus = Mod+Proficiency+1/2 level+Magic

Assumed PC attack vs average monster AC at level 1:

4+2+0+0=6 vs. 15=14+1

Chance to hit = 55%

Assumed PC attack vs average monster AC at level 15:

6+2+7+3=18 vs 29=14+15

Chance to hit = 45%

Assumed PC attack vs average monster AC at level 25:

7+2+12+6=27 vs 39=14+25

Chance to hit = 40%

Assumed PC attack vs average monster AC at level 30:

8+2+15+6=31 vs 44=14+30

Chance to hit = 35%

Now with expertise:

Average Monster AC = 14+Level
Average PC Attack Bonus = Mod+Proficiency+1/2 level+Magic+Expertise

Assumed PC attack vs average monster AC at level 1:

4+2+0+0+1=7 vs. 15=14+1

Chance to hit = 60%

Assumed PC attack vs average monster AC at level 15:

6+2+7+3+2=20 vs 29=14+15

Chance to hit = 55%

Assumed PC attack vs average monster AC at level 25:

7+2+12+6=30 vs 39=14+25

Chance to hit = 55%

Assumed PC attack vs average monster AC at level 30:

8+2+15+6+3=34 vs 44=14+30

Chance to hit = 50%

 

[mach1.9pants]

Well, my current experience is that heroic level characters don't need the feat.

This might change when my groups hit paragon or epic.

Yeah my guys at 8th seem to be hitting fine, although the martial guys had trouble against an ettin, the others didn't!

However I am allowing them to pick the feats anyway, I don't see the need for expertise feats yet, but I do see the want. But only 2 of the 4 PCs have chosen them so they are not a feat tax IMC.

 

[jasin]

I might choose both.

Which would you choose first, the one in PHB1 or the one in PHB2?

Assuming your answer is PHB2, doesn't this reversal strike you as odd?

 

[Starfox]

I'm waiting for (riffing off of posters on the WotC boards):

"Everything Expertise"
Benefit: Your character gets +1 to hit with all attacks. At level 15, this increases to +2. At level 25, this increases to +3. This bonus doesn't stack with any other "Expertise" feats you have. If you are level 5 or higher, gain an additional feat.

"Defense Expertise"
Benefit: Your character gets +1 to Fortitude, Reflex, and Will. At level 15, this increases to +2. At level 25, this increases to +3. This bonus doesn't stack with the feats Robust Defenses, Epic Fortitude, Epic Reflexes, or Epic Will. If you are level 5 or higher, gain an additional feat.

Then you grant this feat as a bonus feat to everyone. Scaling problem solved!

 

[jasin]

Then you grant this feat as a bonus feat to everyone. Scaling problem solved!

I think you missed the final clause in Elric's feats.

 

[CapnZapp]

I'm waiting for (riffing off of posters on the WotC boards):

"Everything Expertise"
Benefit: Your character gets +1 to hit with all attacks. At level 15, this increases to +2. At level 25, this increases to +3. This bonus doesn't stack with any other "Expertise" feats you have. If you are level 5 or higher, gain an additional feat.

"Defense Expertise"
Benefit: Your character gets +1 to Fortitude, Reflex, and Will. At level 15, this increases to +2. At level 25, this increases to +3. This bonus doesn't stack with the feats Robust Defenses, Epic Fortitude, Epic Reflexes, or Epic Will. If you are level 5 or higher, gain an additional feat.

QFT!

I really really want to hear WotCs explanation why this wasn't included in errata, instead of us to go out having to buy PHB14 to get these feats!!