ICv2 - Rolling for Initiative--Oh, By the Way...
It seems there have been going some abrupt changes of plans in the Wotc quarters.
It seems there have been going some abrupt changes of plans in the Wotc quarters.
Scott Thorne, a retailer, comments on recent events
Treebore
First Post
I sure find this line very interesting:
"As far as the publishing side, Pazio’s Pathfinder line appears to have taken a huge chunk of market share away from D&D, with many stores reporting it supplanting 4th edition as their number one seller."
Can't say I am surprised, and certainly believe it to be true. Since it as announced that Paizo was essentially even with WOTC last quarter.
I wondered at the time if Paizo would take the lead, and at this time I believe they will. Customer relations really help, and only Paizo acknowledges that.
WOTC likes to operate as if we have to go where they take us. They are failing to realize a lot of us know we don't have to follow.
That, combined with over 100 pages of errata for their book line, are the reasons why I think WOTC is losing so much ground to Paizo, and I am looking forward to seeing how their futures play out.
Please don't take this as a "bashing" post, I clearly like Paizo much better as a company. Simple as that. I don't run or play 4E or Pathfinder, but I do buy way more than I should from Paizo.
The only thing I buy religiously from WOTC is their tiles. Prior to 4E I pretty much bought everything. I know WOTC misses me and others like me.
We made them far more money in the 3E days, now our money goes to Paizo and others.
WOTC is struggling, we know it, some of us know why. Now the question is, will WOTC figure out how to win us back before Hasbro shuts them down?
My money is on Paizo. Not because I want WOTC to fail, but because I simply believe they won't figure out how to win us back in time. I would love for WOTC to succeed, to bring me back. D&D has been a big part of my life for over 20 years, and I certainly do not want that to go away.
I want WOTC to get the message, to figure it out, to bring me back into the D&D family.
But I think Paizo is going to do it first, with this "introductory" Pathfinder James Jacobs is working on.
But I am going to have to continue to sit back and wait and see.
In the mean time playing with Castle and Crusades and following the OSR movement, and buying way too much awesome Paizo adventures and map and card products, all that will keep me pretty happy.
WOTC turning things around would make me even happier.
"As far as the publishing side, Pazio’s Pathfinder line appears to have taken a huge chunk of market share away from D&D, with many stores reporting it supplanting 4th edition as their number one seller."
Can't say I am surprised, and certainly believe it to be true. Since it as announced that Paizo was essentially even with WOTC last quarter.
I wondered at the time if Paizo would take the lead, and at this time I believe they will. Customer relations really help, and only Paizo acknowledges that.
WOTC likes to operate as if we have to go where they take us. They are failing to realize a lot of us know we don't have to follow.
That, combined with over 100 pages of errata for their book line, are the reasons why I think WOTC is losing so much ground to Paizo, and I am looking forward to seeing how their futures play out.
Please don't take this as a "bashing" post, I clearly like Paizo much better as a company. Simple as that. I don't run or play 4E or Pathfinder, but I do buy way more than I should from Paizo.
The only thing I buy religiously from WOTC is their tiles. Prior to 4E I pretty much bought everything. I know WOTC misses me and others like me.
We made them far more money in the 3E days, now our money goes to Paizo and others.
WOTC is struggling, we know it, some of us know why. Now the question is, will WOTC figure out how to win us back before Hasbro shuts them down?
My money is on Paizo. Not because I want WOTC to fail, but because I simply believe they won't figure out how to win us back in time. I would love for WOTC to succeed, to bring me back. D&D has been a big part of my life for over 20 years, and I certainly do not want that to go away.
I want WOTC to get the message, to figure it out, to bring me back into the D&D family.
But I think Paizo is going to do it first, with this "introductory" Pathfinder James Jacobs is working on.
But I am going to have to continue to sit back and wait and see.
In the mean time playing with Castle and Crusades and following the OSR movement, and buying way too much awesome Paizo adventures and map and card products, all that will keep me pretty happy.
WOTC turning things around would make me even happier.
Jason Bulmahn
Adventurer
Woo hoo. When I get into work tomorrow, I am so going to ask James how this is coming along...
Makes my life sooo much easier.
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing
(and no worries Treebore, folks get me and James mixed up all the time. Its better now then when Paizo had three James, a Jeremy, two Jeffs, and a Jason)
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Dice4Hire
First Post
Woo hoo. When I get into work tomorrow, I am so going to ask James how this is coming along...
Makes my life sooo much easier.
Sure the NDA is not stopping you from talking about this?
So Paizo's taken a chunk out of WotC off-the-shelf market share. Well, so what?
Isn't the fact that WotC's focusing on DDI and the subscription format make this a fait accompli? It just makes logical sense. They're voluntarily giving up publishing market share, because they make more money via DDI subscriptions than they do for hardcover book sales.
This doesn't mean WotC's in trouble... it doesn't mean they need to find ways to "win back" the disenfranchised... it just means they are changing their means of distribution (much to the chagrin of the game sellers, whom I'm sure would rather keep the sales of WotC products as they probably made the sellers a good chunk of change.)
Isn't the fact that WotC's focusing on DDI and the subscription format make this a fait accompli? It just makes logical sense. They're voluntarily giving up publishing market share, because they make more money via DDI subscriptions than they do for hardcover book sales.
This doesn't mean WotC's in trouble... it doesn't mean they need to find ways to "win back" the disenfranchised... it just means they are changing their means of distribution (much to the chagrin of the game sellers, whom I'm sure would rather keep the sales of WotC products as they probably made the sellers a good chunk of change.)
Dire Bare
Legend
If I remember the (older) article directly, Paizo was #2 after D&D in RPG sales in hobby stores. This did not include all D&D products, such as board games (which, while a small number of products now, one, seem to be becoming more important to the D&D brand), and more importantly, miniatures (although, those are gone now, sad). It also only referenced hobby store sales, not online sales (Amazon) or big box sales (B&N, Target).
Edit: It also didn't take into account the difference in volume between #1 and #2.
Paizo is awesomesauce mixed with even more awesomesauce, but they never have been serious competition to WotC.
But you're right, with D&D products starting to focus on props - cards of various sorts (Fortune, deck in Shadowfell boxed set, deck of many things, and tokens, perhaps more to come) and with major "crunch" support seemingly moving online . . . . Paizo and other RPG companies will start to play catch-up in the printed RPG book in hobby stores category, but still won't seriously compete with WotC.
Doesn't bother me either way. I like 4e and I lurve Pathfinder, and props help my game either way! 5 years from now, I'll still be playing either D&D or Pathfinder, or perhaps even still both!
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Dire Bare
Legend
Not really (IMO, of course). He doesn't know anymore than we do, and all he really is saying is that he doesn't like the changes themselves, and he doesn't like the way WotC communicated those changes to the retailers.
I'm indifferent to the canceled books, excited about the book changing to hardcover, and sad about the loss of the minis line (although, I haven't purchased minis for years). I also think WotC could have communicated to both the fans and the retailers much better . . . .
However, it's my opinion that WotC isn't deliberately trying to keep anybody in the dark, but rather the D&D line is going through some rapid changes due to management decisions based on recent sales data. WotC is trying to adapt to a changing market and come ahead. Will they succeed? Time will tell. They guys who communicate about the game to fans and retailers are playing catch up, and the ground is still shifting beneath them. Not due to incompetence, not due to neglect, and certainly not due to indifference. But due the need to reinvent the game to succeed in a market that is in a constant state of flux.
