What changes/additions to multiclassing would you like to see?

[I'm A Banana]

My quick-and-dirty Multiclassing rules:

[sblock=MULTIBALLS]

• Spend a Feat, Gain an Extra Power. You buy access to a new power with your feat. Any power you want, as long as its lower than your level. Just do it. If it's an always-on class feature (like a proficiency), you gain it. Congrats.
• Adjust The Power's "Cost". At-wills become Encounter powers. Encounter powers stay Encounter powers, and now cost you a healing surge to use. Daily powers stay Daily powers, and now cost you an Action Point to use.
• That's All. If your fighter desperately wants to spend all of their surges and action points to activate their Ranger powers and act like a Ranger for a combat, that is fine. The concern here is that this will cause more frequent "Resting," which, for my games, isn't that big of a deal. Characters generally get an extended rest every 2 or 3 encounters anyway, and rarely deplete all of their surges. Extended rests also have a cost associated with them (see the Resting Rules -- they generally make encounters harder and close off options for extra treasure). If it becomes a Big Deal at some point, consider giving out "power surges" that can only be used to activate special abilities (also, rituals...see the ritual rules).

[/sblock]

 

[Zaran]

My quick-and-dirty Multiclassing rules:


[sblock=MULTIBALLS]

• Spend a Feat, Gain an Extra Power. You buy access to a new power with your feat. Any power you want, as long as its lower than your level. Just do it. If it's an always-on class feature (like a proficiency), you gain it. Congrats.
• Adjust The Power's "Cost". At-wills become Encounter powers. Encounter powers stay Encounter powers, and now cost you a healing surge to use. Daily powers stay Daily powers, and now cost you an Action Point to use.
• That's All. If your fighter desperately wants to spend all of their surges and action points to activate their Ranger powers and act like a Ranger for a combat, that is fine. The concern here is that this will cause more frequent "Resting," which, for my games, isn't that big of a deal. Characters generally get an extended rest every 2 or 3 encounters anyway, and rarely deplete all of their surges. Extended rests also have a cost associated with them (see the Resting Rules -- they generally make encounters harder and close off options for extra treasure). If it becomes a Big Deal at some point, consider giving out "power surges" that can only be used to activate special abilities (also, rituals...see the ritual rules).

[/sblock]

Do your players actually use this? I don't like the idea of spending life energy to get an extra encounter power. Seems to miss the point of multiclassing. Multiclassing, to me, is to make a character that doesn't fit the mold.

 

[Jools]

Got a link for that quote? I'd like to read more about DDXP.

First a quote from the DDXP Q&A session:
"Q: Do you guys have any plans on exploring options for cross-classing/multi-classing in fourth edition more similar to third edition?

A:
(Mike Mearls) Yes.
(Trevor Kidd) I've been play-testing some of this. I'm really excited about some of this.
(Mike Mearls) Yeah, It's definitely something we are working on and thinking about and testing."

 

[hayek]

Got a link for that quote? I'd like to read more about DDXP.

Not sure if there's a transcript somewhere, but the Tome Show podcast has full audio of the entire Q&A, along with a few other seminars.

 

[hayek]

The reason I want more multiclassing or cross-classing options is because I want to be able to play interesting combinations of characters. I don't care at all about optimization, I just don't want a PC that is cool to me in concept and completely gimped when in the middle of a fight.

I'm a fan of Bards and Wizards. The concepts, not the powers. Trying to hybrid those classes leaves you with a PC that can't do a lot though.

...

However, for those of us who have no need or desire to make Superman with a Sword, there should be viable options to make conceptually rich options without being handcuffed.

But how much are rules for MCing needed if it's just the concept you're interested in. There's nothing that keeps your wizard from reskinning himself as part bard, and carrying around a musical instrument. They're both arcane casters, and the right background can give you skill training in some traditionally 'bardic' skills like Diplomacy or Bluff. Magic items can be easily reskinned - tell your DM to call the magic wand you picked up a magic harp.

Of course, rules for MCing will help you bridge the concept a little more, but that's a small benefit with a huge potential downside of having the game flooded with completely nonsensical, un-thematic characters that dominate the battlefield, "I'm playing a Genasi Fire Soul, Hybrid Swordmage-Barbarian, Multiclassed Rogue and Cleric, with a Warlock Paragon Path. His name is Urkoth, but you can call him 'Much better than you'."

I just don't want a PC that is cool to me in concept and completely gimped when in the middle of a fight.

If you think you feel like a gimp now, introduce some haphazard MC rules like they had in 3.5, and you will be amazed at how pathetic your character looks next to a well-optimized design.

since I didn't play D&D prior to 4E.
...
I'm confident that WotC won't just release a broken design that allows power gamers to destroy the game's structure.

well, you certainly backed up your claim to have not played D&D prior to 4e. Anyone who played 3.5, especially the poor souls who had a power gamer in their group, have very little confidence that WotC will refrain from introducing mind-bending, insane brokenness into the game.

 

[frogged]

Got a link for that quote? I'd like to read more about DDXP.

Here is a link to some live blogging of most of the seminars at DDXP. Unfortunately, these are only live blogging notes and not accurate transcripts.

Here is a link to The Tome Show which has recordings of a few of seminars (currently just the second Product Seminar, Expert DM Seminar, and the Q&A Seminar).

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

If you think you feel like a gimp now, introduce some haphazard MC rules like they had in 3.5, and you will be amazed at how pathetic your character looks next to a well-optimized design.

IMHO, the only issue I saw with 3.5Ed multiclassing wasn't the rules but the underlying quality & structure of the classes and PrCls plugged into it.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Double post deleted.

 

[Greg K]

I like the 4e heroic tier multiclassing rules. It is how I wish it had been done in 3e for picking up a new class after first level. No dipping into say the fighter class to gain proficiency in all armor and weapons and a +2 save bonus to circumvent taking the armor, weapon and appropriate save bonus feat.

I also like the hybrid rules for multiclassed starting characters.

 

[hayek]

IMHO, the only issue I saw with 3.5Ed multiclassing wasn't the rules but the underlying quality & structure of the classes and PrCls plugged into it.

Yeah i could see that. But i think multiclassing has a huge potential to magnify any of those underlying issues. To create any blanket rules that allow the combination of so many powers and features in the game just seems destined to cause problems.