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Essentials multiclassing playtest?
- Thread starter BobTheNob
- Start date
That's likely because as a hybrid it's one step closer to being a theme, which it should have been from the start.
Dice4Hire
First Post
I cannot read it, but I am 100% certain this is correct.
It gives you absolutely ALL the vampires fun stuff and then you put it on top of the class of your choice (with the other feat to make it even more neat). It's like this is the way it should have been.
Destil
Explorer
What are you talking about? They hit the ball out of the park with that one.
Half of 0 is 0. Hybrid binder is perfect.
Not sure if this works, but...
Executioner takes Pact Initiate (Warlock MC feat) and chooses a pact, then takes Pact Blade Manifestation from the article, and ends up getting a sweet MBA replacement that uses DEX thanks to the Executioner class feature, and qualifies for Cursed Shadow at the same time?
Seems potentially awesome.
Executioner takes Pact Initiate (Warlock MC feat) and chooses a pact, then takes Pact Blade Manifestation from the article, and ends up getting a sweet MBA replacement that uses DEX thanks to the Executioner class feature, and qualifies for Cursed Shadow at the same time?
Seems potentially awesome.
There used to be a very simple way, then they took it out by removing the level from the power. It's a head-scratching design decision, but it seems intentional that Cavaliers and only Cavaliers get horsies that level up.
I agree with those above who said the Pact Blade feat looks like a lot of fun. Too bad there is no Dark Pact hexblade build yet--though you could probably let Dark Pact count as Gloom Pact for that purpose.
WalterKovacs
First Post
Some stuff probably needs to be addressed (the cavalier hybrid probably needs some sort of hybrid "update". If only making it's OA power an Immediate Action, to prevent it being a full defender in terms of 'mark+punishment' regardless of the other half of the class.
Similarly, the monk's unarmored defense and avenger's armor of faith require hybrid talent, but the vampire gets it's reflex right away (it is a shield bonus, while the others are untyped, so that could be part of it). Consistency would say it probably has to be put into the hyrbid talent options, although it would probably be better if the other features were put into the original class (or perhaps put into 'equivalent of leather/hide armor in determining worse of 2' ... with the unarmored agility being the equivalent of adding a heavy shield). They would probably need to make sure the class features don't stack if they did that. [Altough, at the moment, a vampire + monk or avenger with hybrid talent can have some awesome AC the way things are. A monk/Avenger [or swordmage] can do that now, but it does require double hybrid talent, and thus needing to take the hybrid paragon path.
The "able to use MBAs for striker bonus damage" for the executioner assassin is interesting, and could become more so in the case of classes with a "counts as MBA" power. An executioner/warlock, for example, could use eldrtich strike (or the new feat) to use a warlock mba and get both curse damage and executioner bonus damage on the same attack (and throw assassin's strike on top of that). They may need to clarify things to avoid those kinds of loopholes (i.e. only MBAs that don't have a class/level associated?)
Another unintended consequences thing to test would be archery mastery. How would in interact with say, a ranger/warlock hybrid. Would it allow for use of both quarry and curse? It would be interesting to see a half-elf picking this up by grabbing a ranger power via dilletante, and then having fun with it with "counts as rba" powers. A half-elf mage would have some fun with magic missle combined with being able to slide/prone/slow(s/e) or make it a burst.
The vampire stuff at least creates some interesting options via hybrid or multiclassing into vampire. Considering stuff like the backgrounds which determine hp based on different stats ... someone can dump stat con and multi into vampire and have some interesting stuff going on. A martial or primal defender could make use of the extra surges and extra regen. Psionic/arcane controllers on the other hand can, if they are succesfully protected by their allies, benefit greatly from alternate outlets for 'extra' surges ... especially as they would have lots of extra surges in a fight. The Psionic Vampire is especially interesting because, if you go with minimum augmentation, you can get a lot more healing surges (potentially). The thing to remember with those is that, unlike blood drinker, you don't get to keep trying to hit, so you could miss with an encounter power and lose a chance to gain a surge (also, encounter powers without attack rolls would be wasted ... so multiclassing from knight or slayer into vampire may not be the best idea.
Similarly, the monk's unarmored defense and avenger's armor of faith require hybrid talent, but the vampire gets it's reflex right away (it is a shield bonus, while the others are untyped, so that could be part of it). Consistency would say it probably has to be put into the hyrbid talent options, although it would probably be better if the other features were put into the original class (or perhaps put into 'equivalent of leather/hide armor in determining worse of 2' ... with the unarmored agility being the equivalent of adding a heavy shield). They would probably need to make sure the class features don't stack if they did that. [Altough, at the moment, a vampire + monk or avenger with hybrid talent can have some awesome AC the way things are. A monk/Avenger [or swordmage] can do that now, but it does require double hybrid talent, and thus needing to take the hybrid paragon path.
The "able to use MBAs for striker bonus damage" for the executioner assassin is interesting, and could become more so in the case of classes with a "counts as MBA" power. An executioner/warlock, for example, could use eldrtich strike (or the new feat) to use a warlock mba and get both curse damage and executioner bonus damage on the same attack (and throw assassin's strike on top of that). They may need to clarify things to avoid those kinds of loopholes (i.e. only MBAs that don't have a class/level associated?)
Another unintended consequences thing to test would be archery mastery. How would in interact with say, a ranger/warlock hybrid. Would it allow for use of both quarry and curse? It would be interesting to see a half-elf picking this up by grabbing a ranger power via dilletante, and then having fun with it with "counts as rba" powers. A half-elf mage would have some fun with magic missle combined with being able to slide/prone/slow(s/e) or make it a burst.
The vampire stuff at least creates some interesting options via hybrid or multiclassing into vampire. Considering stuff like the backgrounds which determine hp based on different stats ... someone can dump stat con and multi into vampire and have some interesting stuff going on. A martial or primal defender could make use of the extra surges and extra regen. Psionic/arcane controllers on the other hand can, if they are succesfully protected by their allies, benefit greatly from alternate outlets for 'extra' surges ... especially as they would have lots of extra surges in a fight. The Psionic Vampire is especially interesting because, if you go with minimum augmentation, you can get a lot more healing surges (potentially). The thing to remember with those is that, unlike blood drinker, you don't get to keep trying to hit, so you could miss with an encounter power and lose a chance to gain a surge (also, encounter powers without attack rolls would be wasted ... so multiclassing from knight or slayer into vampire may not be the best idea.
Since it's a playtest, it's important for all of us to remember to send in all this info to WotC themselves, and not just cheer or rail against it here. There's still time for many of these issues to be addressed... let's just not assume that they will read all the ENWorld threads that talk about them.
