Everybody has Spring Attack

[Rhenny]

Why can't monsters and PCs just ready attacks to deal with this? If all the PCs are hiding around a corner, then all the kobolds ready an action to shoot at the first PC who comes around to attack.

Likewise, the PCs can ready attacks to kill kobolds who move next to them. This should end a kobold karousel pretty fast.

Yes. That is the smart choice. Since the pop out attacker won't be able to see the foes out of his turn, he will get a nasty surprise when 10 arrows fly at him the next time he pops out.

 

[Crazy Jerome]

My answer: don't change a thing

It's easy to look at the history of design and say that aoos are important and necessary, but it's time like these to reevaluate those assumptions. It's true that with these rules we will get very different actions from what we are used to, but it does not mean its a bad thing

Well, my preferred answer would be to drop cyclic initiative like the time-destroying, rules expanding thingy it is, in favor of the older side-by-side initiative rules, thus neatly bypassing the problem altogether. Whether one sees this as changing what is there or doubling down on getting those "very different actions" is in the eye of the beholder.

 

[LostSoul]

Well, my preferred answer would be to drop cyclic initiative like the time-destroying, rules expanding thingy it is, in favor of the older side-by-side initiative rules, thus neatly bypassing the problem altogether. Whether one sees this as changing what is there or doubling down on getting those "very different actions" is in the eye of the beholder.

My preferred answer as well. (Can't XP, etc.)

 

[jadrax]

IMO attacking or casting a spell should end your turn unless you have a feat or class ability that lets you do otherwise. Kobold carousels are not nearly as bad as kobold snipers shooting from battlements and ducking into cover. Players shouldn't have to ready an action to fight most things.

I strongly disagree: Pop-up attacks from cover are precisily the kind of thing the rules should be encouraging, it is how actual ranged fighting works.

 

[Gargoyle]

I strongly disagree: Pop-up attacks from cover are precisily the kind of thing the rules should be encouraging, it is how actual ranged fighting works.

I don't want my game to work like actual ranged fighting. I want it to be fun.

 

[Frostmarrow]

I'd tie it to armor. By introducing two stats to armor called Actions and Pace we get the following: Actions are the number of actions the armor allows for. One of these can be an attack (or spell). Pace is the number of feet a move Action covers.

                Actions Pace
Leather            4     10"
Chainmail          3     15"
Platemail          2     20"

To change direction you need to use another move action. So a character wearing light armor can run up to a wall, climb it, and jump an enemy on the other side using move, move, move, attack. This would not be possible in plate for example. Movement in heavy armor is not slower but a bit more restricted.

The feel of playing a heavily armored warrior changes dramatically from playing a character in light armor. You are just as fast but your options are a bit more limited in the flexibility department. It also means that the spring attack move the OP mentioned can be pulled off in light and even medium armor but not in heavy. (I don't care if it's realistic, just that it feels right).

This makes armor a strategic choice. Heavy armor is great in open spaces and lighter armors shine in tunnels and woods. I think it would be great if a knight opted for no armor in a cluttered space due to the tactical advantages of being able to change direction often. The opposite is also true. On a battle field even the rogue should see the advantages of donning chainmail.

Note: The table is just for show. Exact numbers may vary.

 

[jadrax]

I don't want my game to work like actual ranged fighting. I want it to be fun.

Fun is subjective, I find having to stand in the open for a round to use ranged weapons makes using ranged weapons about as much fun as nailing various dangling bits of my anatomy to a table.

 

[Rhenny]

If you want to limit movement in combat, the idea to use contests or checks to "disengage" or "move past/through threatened spaces" at this point is the only option that is consistent with the core rules. I like it. I've been using it in my playtests, and it adds an extra thrill to combat, limiting erratic movement, but still allowing for more dynamic combats.

If creature A wins the contest, he or she can disengage or move past or through treatened spaces. If creature A fails, he must stop movement...end. Perhaps the DM can assign "disadvantage" if creature A has to move through more than one threatened space.

This is logical, and consistent with the core rules. There doesn't have to be an attack...basically this allows us to mechanically simulate the following:

Creature A wants to do something that Creature B wants to prevent (opposes). It is clear and consistent.

This is something I posted in another thread, but it makes sense for this thread too.

 

[Gargoyle]

Fun is subjective, I find having to stand in the open for a round to use ranged weapons makes using ranged weapons about as much fun as nailing various dangling bits of my anatomy to a table.

I agree that fun is subjective, and I will agree to disagree with you about what is fun with respect to ranged attacks.

But I think you'd enjoy playing in my game at least slightly more than nailing appendages to a table. IMC you'd have the option to have it your way by taking a spring attack - like feat. I feel that overall giving such an ability to everyone results in less fun because of the awkwardness of readying actions.

 

[Stalker0]

Keep in mind that while the new rules do allow those archers to just pop out of cover and right back in.....it also allows the big melee guy to just race into that group of archers because he doesn't worry about AOOs.

That's why I think its worth trying as is, certain actions are now possible that were not before, but at the same time new counters are also available.