Energy Drain

[The Shadow]

Of all the monsters in the playtest Bestiary, the most disappointing is the wight.

First off, because it can only last a round against a party of 5e characters, two if it gets lucky.

But much more importantly, its Energy Drain power is pathetically unscary. 1d8+2 damage, and the wight heals half that much. Honestly, it's better off using its sword.

How the mighty have fallen! Energy-draining undead were TERRIFYING in 1e and 2e. Say what you will about the stupidity of the mechanic - and it was plenty stupid - but it did instill a very wholesome terror in both players and characters. 3e toned them down a lot, but they were still scary.

1d8+2 damage isn't even remotely scary. It's just like hitting someone with a sword, with the exception of the vampiric healing and the spawning upon death.

What made energy draining terrifying was the fact that you got steadily weaker and less capable as the thing attacked you... and that there was a very good chance you wouldn't get your levels back. Most scary of all, these things could kill 1st-level characters with but a touch!

Now, level-draining itself is dumb. But what can we replace it with, that will have the same effect?

One possibility is draining Constitution - or perhaps even all the ability scores. That's certainly ugly, especially in 5e, but recalculating one's sheet with each hit does not appeal. And if you don't recalculate, it's not as scary... though if you die when any ability hits 0 (or 2?) then there's some potential.

Another possibility is being drained of some high fraction of your hit points. Let's say a wight's touch takes half your current hit points, or 10 hp, whichever is worse. So a 40 hp fighter goes to 20, then 10, then he's dead. He can take one more hit than a 1st level fighter can, but it still feels deadly.

Oh, and if you go to zero? You aren't 'dying', you're dead. Is that too harsh? Maybe the wight needs to coup-de-grace you.

Yet another possibility would be an 'Energy Drained' condition, which gives penalties (or even disadvantage?) to certain checks and saves? Yet this wouldn't escalate with further hits, which is part of the terror that is energy drain.

Any other thoughts?

 

[Shadeydm]

I think energy drained as a condition might be the best bet however 5E also needs to learn from 4E to avoid the piling on of too many simultanious condiions on players or monsters. There have been enough posts detailing the undesirable effects of stacking conditions that I won't waste space rehashing them.

 

[slobo777]

If any creatures deserve to put nasty conditions on PCs, then undead get my vote.

I'd go for Hit Dice drain - with a minor condition attached. Then put a major condition on someone who's already out of Hit Dice.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I always liked the original- sure it was nasty for bookkeeping, but it felt right.

In 5Ed, it could be a 4 step condition degradation. To use 3Ed terminology, I think it could work by making a PC Fatigued => Exhausted => Staggered => Unconscious.

 

[Scipio202]

Lose levels but not XP

Talysman had an idea I like - energy drain takes away levels but not XP. So you still get a lot weaker during the combat (losing hp, spells, CS and SA dice, etc.) but if you survive you can get back your levels pretty quickly. He suggested that you can regain 1 level per adventure as long as you gain at least 1 new XP.

 

[Shadeydm]

Talysman had an idea I like - energy drain takes away levels but not XP. So you still get a lot weaker during the combat (losing hp, spells, CS and SA dice, etc.) but if you survive you can get back your levels pretty quickly. He suggested that you can regain 1 level per adventure as long as you gain at least 1 new XP.

Bookeeping the effects of a level loss or multiple level losses even if temporary does not sound fun to me...I think we even had this in one of the editions although I don't recall which one it might have been 3E but i'm not sure.

 

[The Shadow]

If any creatures deserve to put nasty conditions on PCs, then undead get my vote.

I'd go for Hit Dice drain - with a minor condition attached. Then put a major condition on someone who's already out of Hit Dice.

Ooooh! I like that! I hadn't thought of draining hit dice, at all!

Maybe for each hit die drained, the wight gets to roll it to heal?

What would the major condition be?

In 5Ed, it could be a 4 step condition degradation. To use 3Ed terminology, I think it could work by making a PC Fatigued => Exhausted => Staggered => Unconscious.

That certainly does get the escalation in, I could go for something like that. Though there should be a step of Dead somewhere at the end of the line.

 

[Shadeydm]

Ooooh! I like that! I hadn't thought of draining hit dice, at all!

Maybe for each hit die drained, the wight gets to roll it to heal?

What would the major condition be?



That certainly does get the escalation in, I could go for something like that. Though there should be a step of Dead somewhere at the end of the line.

Both ideas have merit and don't involve too much bookkeeping and would help put the fear of the undead back ino the game. What about ghouls should they have a condition like paralysis again?

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

What about ghouls should they have a condition like paralysis again?

Abso-damn-lately!

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

In 5Ed, it could be a 4 step condition degradation. To use 3Ed terminology, I think it could work by making a PC Fatigued => Exhausted => Staggered => Unconscious.

That certainly does get the escalation in, I could go for something like that. Though there should be a step of Dead somewhere at the end of the line.

Once you're Unconscious, there is always Coup de Grace.

Killing with Energy Drain should be the first step for Spawning from fallen victims, though. Maybe as a non-combat Ritual.