Castle Defense

[haakon1]

Should a typical D&D castle have ballistae and/or catapults ready for defense at any time? Or would these only be assembled/emplaced if trouble seemed likely?

I'm thinking for a "realistic" semi-historical setting. For example, I think normal castles would have supplies for a siege, but would not have hoardings (wooden structures the extend over the walls to attack people at the base of the walls) or oil already boiling and ready to pour on attackers unless a siege was in progress.

And I think a besieging army would typically not travel with siege weapons, but would build them on the spot.

But defenders, I'm not sure.

My players are preparing to try to storm a castle that has not had more than a few hours to prepare.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

I don't think castles used catapults and other siege weapons to defend a castle. But that would scare an attacking army.

I don't know what a hoarding is, but is there any reason not to have one? Do they get in the way?

I figure a castle would only have "standard" defenses ready. Stockpiled oil, but not boiling, so maybe they can slick up anyone trying to climb a wall or ladder. Hooks on poles, for pushing ladders off. Rocks and other things to throw in the murder holes, plus arrows or crossbow bolts for the arrow slits, but I doubt a small group of PCs would go in through the front door (at least, not without social engineering, which PCs tend to be good at).

In fact, PCs are almost perfect for bypassing a castle's defenses, since they're a small group with access to magic, rather than a large easily-spotted army. They could probably climb up the garbage chute, if such things existed. Past 7th-level, and the PCs have access to Dimension Door. You can start teleporting small groups into a castle at that point. Only a really big castle is likely to have anti-teleport defenses, which would have to be permanent and hugely expensive.

 

[LostSoul]

I don't think that the catapults and ballistae would be loaded, but I think they'd be there, ready for use. Maybe covered with a tarp or something. I don't think the ropes lose tension in the unloaded/unready state.

 

[haakon1]

So one vote FOR and one AGAINST siege engines being ready to go. Same need for a runoff election in my mind. Hmmm.

 

[haakon1]

I don't know what a hoarding is, but is there any reason not to have one? Do they get in the way?

3 reasons: obscure observation from the walls, wooden so less durable/need more maintenance, and ugly.

No magical defenses for this castle. The PC's have a few hundred militia, including 25 sappers (combat engineers), but they know another enemy force is less than an hour away. So they are planning a quick coup de main -- frontal assault to take the castle as quickly as possible -- before the other bad guys arrive.

They are thinking battering ram to the front gate (there's no moat), then ride in, while their militia archers engage the enemy on the wall (who they believe they outnumber about 10-1). What they don't know is the bad guys also have some serious monsters . . . but they were not expecting an all out assault. They were planning to attack their primary objective at midnight, about 5 game hours from now.

 

[Celebrim]

Should a typical D&D castle have ballistae and/or catapults ready for defense at any time?

Yes.

Two reasons. First, D&D seige weapons are probably more powerful and useful than real world equivalents. Second, in the fantasy world there are more viable targets for seige weapon equivalent weapons.

I'm thinking for a "realistic" semi-historical setting. For example, I think normal castles would have supplies for a siege, but would not have hoardings (wooden structures the extend over the walls to attack people at the base of the walls) or oil already boiling and ready to pour on attackers unless a siege was in progress.

This is all true, but only certain sorts of realistic castles end up being viable in a setting with flying attackers. Hordings have to be purpose built in the D&D setting. Open topped walls and towers of the sort associated with the most intense period of English castle building, and of the sort consequently most English speakers are most familiar with, aren't viable. Keep in mind that the west rarely saw castles besieged by peer level foes. Most castles where used essentially to supress local insurrections (England) or simply to make it clear to your king that he can't force you to act against your will (France) or to otherwise maintain local independence (Germany). You really need to look to Spain, the Crusader castles, and the east (Czech, Poland) for serious castle building.

And I think a besieging army would typically not travel with siege weapons, but would build them on the spot.

This is true. But now a besieging army can include things like mammoths and giants.

But defenders, I'm not sure.

In the West, purpose built anti-seige weapons were fairly rare before the invention of cannon. They do show up in the Crusader castles and elsewhere in the east however.

 

[Celebrim]

No magical defenses for this castle.

Then it's essentially useless. One 3rd level wizard can overcome the castle defences entirely.

I won't go into castle building in the D&D world at length, because I don't think its relevant to your question.

But let me ask this question, who built this castle and why? What were they trying to accomplish?

 

[haakon1]

But let me ask this question, who built this castle and why? What were they trying to accomplish?

Adapted from the Baron's Keep in the city of Brindinford in the adventure "The Speaker in Dreams". In my campaign, it's the City of Falwur, which is in Bissel. In my campaign, Falwur is Bissel's 2nd city, and the closest major city to Ket, the neighboring country with which Bissel is now and has often been at war, but it's far from the current front, as the battle has moved into Ket -- it's more of a staging area/supply depot in the war right now.

The Baron's Keep is home of the Baron and his family, and the office of his castellan who manages the city. So, a bit of a Downtown Abbey combined with City Hall.

It's houses the barracks for his Town Guard (who are professional troops who guard both the Keep and the City), a dungeon for prisoners, and storage facility for siege supplies and armaments.

It also forms part of the city wall, over a steep hill where the city's aqueduct from the mountains enters a cistern and then flows in pipe downhill.

It's not "useless" because it's a relatively low power campaign. The guys who took it over are mostly 1st-2nd level Fighters, who used help from some monsters and a handful of NPC's of levels 3-8 or so do the deed.

The Militia facing them are Warrior 1's and a few Aristocrat 1 or Expert 1, for the most part. The one surviving officer of the Guards after the coup d'état is a 3rd level Fighter.

The coup plotters who took the Keep kidnapped all but one of the Clerics over 3rd level in the town . . . there no Wizards of note in the town. So it's down to the PC's to win the battle. The only group with substantial power the PC's haven't gotten on side (haven't thought of) are the thieves' guild.

If you want the Order of Battle for the opposing sides, let me know.

But I think you answered my question . . . there should be SOME sort of siege defense in place. I'll go with a single ballista on top of the dunjon tower.

 

[Loincloth of Armour]

For your initial question re siege weapons used by a castle: historically, before the age of cannons, not so much. Hard to aim, and most useful AGAINST castles rather than attacking armies. However, if the world has dragons and wyverns, and manticores, and giants... why not?

Also... players kind of expect it, so they might feel 'cheated' if they can't stop/break/dodge a few catapult stones.

No magical defenses for this castle.

Then it fails as a castle.

In the real world we built stone castles because they did protect against common weapons of the time and so were useful to spend your nation's tax money on. If a low level wizard/cleric/druid etc can make a joke out of your very expensive defensive structure, then it was a massive waste of time and money.

I do like the looks of castles and want such things in my settings. Because of this, in my settings... I fudge.

I (as DM) have declared that a castle/fort, etc is built on locations that not only provide good topographical advantages, but also where ley lines and mystical energy wells intersect. The stones that are put up are blessed/marked by runes/etc so that a castle actually does mess with the attackers magic, the same way a stone wall messes with a cavalry charge. They also provide protection against some air attacks.

Rules for this? That's a bit... loose. I play it by ear but basically tell the players, "No direct use of magic is going to be an I WIN button. It's a frigging CASTLE. It doesn't fall easily."

 

[Celebrim]

Some previous discussions that might be relevant:

http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?132021-Castles-and-DnD&p=2248051&viewfull=1#post2248051

http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?273197-Do-castles-make-sense-in-a-world-of-dragons-amp-spells

It sounds like the castle is mostly serving as a seat of government, with little need to face peer level threats from rival nations. It's going to be designed to appear imposing and important, to thwart basic attacks, to serve as a refuge in the event of attack by city threatening monsters, and to allow the process of governance to continue without interruption. As a low level campaign, you don't have to worry about fending off high level magic (and don't have the ability anyway), but many of the biggest problems are 3rd level or less.

As such, I think it will most likely have magical defences, but not ones geared to resisting seiges or assaults. Infiltration, assassination, and espionage or the threats that it will be geared to protect against. As such, it probably has a suite of rooms lined with lead and possibly enchanted to resist scrying. Lead lined safes or vaults for storing secrets and treasure are also likely. It likely has one or two access points which are trapped with invisibility purges, and has permenent alarm spells in places where someone might try to covertly enter. It doesn't seem likely at your power level, but spells which detect shapechangers in choke points would be desirable. The beds of the major government officials will have permenent circles of protection around them or equivalent sorts of defences, to gaurd against mind control, possession, or attack by conjured monsters in their sleep. There will be a kennel for watch dogs, and multidoor interior guard posts at points that access the main living and working suite(s) of the houssehold to protect against charm spells, invisible attackers, ect. There will likely be some sort of poison detecting magic item in the household, and a variaty of minor magical resources - poison antidotes, potions of cure minor wounds, etc. - available. Most of this has little impact on a siege, but I'd consider it nice color. I always like to show that NPCs are fairly compotent and intelligent.

There will almost certainly be ballistas in roof top fighting positions. Dragons and similar mauraders are probably a bigger worry in the national interior than invaders. Heavier weapons are probably unlikely. In fact, more likely is smaller weapons that fall between seige weapon class and handheld weapons. You don't necessarily need to be able to knock down walls, but you do need to be able to hit large mobile targets with lots of natural armor. Two person crewed crossbows designed to peirce armor are I think a likely innovation in a setting with monsters - something like a mini-ballista. The way I generally stat them is they are unwieldy and thus inaccurate (-1 to hit) but reduce armor/natural armor bonus by 5-6 and do 2d6+4 damage (built in strength bonus, needs two wind bow unless you have an 18 str or better), firing rate every 3rd round. Otherwise, like a heavy crossbow.