• NOW LIVE! Into the Woods--new character species, eerie monsters, and haunting villains to populate the woodlands of your D&D games.

Buying magic items vs. finding magic items

I think the "comparitively small pool" is larger than the pool of people who want full plate armor, which costs about as much. So, is there insufficient demand to make up a market for purchasing the armor? Before you answer, remember that the enchantment process takes on the order of days, when armor construction takes weeks or months.

I think that there's probably far more people who are capable of making non-magical armor than there are of enchanting magic items (certainly based on the population tables in the 3.5 DMG), so add that on top of the prohibitive cost, and the answer is a pretty clear yes.

That's even overlooking the fact that full plate armor will add a very large amount to your AC, whereas a +1 longsword is only giving you an +1 to damage over its non-magical counterpart.

If the economics of D&D are also to model something vaguely like historical Europe, then it is, economically speaking, lunacy (unless you've got some simply fantastic productivity). The arms, armor, food, other supply, and livestock required by an army cannot generally be produced on that basis. It is equivalent to having all the arms, armor, food, and so on for each solider to be produced by a single person, on top of that person making enough excess for their own wages and the soldier's. That's just not going to happen.

They aren't meant to model something "vaguely like" historical Europe, unless Europe had magic item shops. They're meant to model a game world, nothing more. Likewise, there's nothing to suggest that the civilian population isn't devoting most of their effort to crafting the supplies for the military - not to mention the idea that some items can be bought via foreign importation to shore up the difference.

Which is yet another example of the fact that you can pretty easily make any economic scenario you want be plausible, something that you keep trying to disprove in what's apparently a bout of One True Way-ism. That's the real lunacy.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Yes, this is thread necromancy. I'm curious how the newer editions of D&D, (with different magic item mechanics), affect this concept.

As soon as I saw "Started by Quasqeton", I knew it was a necro. But it's your thread, so if you want to necro it, that's different I guess.

I think the economic example is only true if there is a history of multiple adventuring type groups, thereby producing the supply and demand you speak of.

My view of D&D is the group that is currently playing in the world is the only (or one of very few) adventuring groups. Most everyone else is normal people. So there is no demand.

To me, the opposite is probably more likely in a typical game world -- a high demand for a small supply of magic items.

Honestly, I favor a moderate approach to the matter. Buying and selling simple and basic items is reasonable in a large enough community, but it's the more powerful items or stuff with specific sorts of abilities that will be more rare and not subject to easy purchace.
 

They aren't meant to model something "vaguely like" historical Europe, unless Europe had magic item shops.
Well, there were alchemists & others who were selling potions, poisons, talismans and the like. No, the items were not actually magical, but commerce in them existed nonetheless.
 





Proprietors of RW "magic" shops would have items of purported magical ability, which were actually or marketable as "scarce", some of which would be of questionable legality. The proprietors would either have or purport to have special knowledge, enabling them to create or acquire such goods.

All of that would be factored into cost.

A FRPG magic shop's main difference would be that the items for sale would actually be able to do what they claimed...occasionally maybe more, maybe less. Besides that one difference, all of the same economic factors applying to he RW alchemist's shop would apply to those in a fantasy world.
 

Besides that one difference, all of the same economic factors applying to he RW alchemist's shop would apply to those in a fantasy world.

I've never really studied economics, so I can't tell if the disconnect is just that I don't understand the definitions; but the difference that I see is that someone selling magic items would have to be akin to an international arms dealer and manufacturer. You do not find one of those in every town, and from my (albeit limited) exposure to such things, if you DO come across one, you're not allowed to browse the aisles or take the jet fighters out for a test drive.

When you're saying "same economic factors" or "economically indistinguishable" what is it that you mean?

What I know that I'm reading incorrectly is "because people in real life buy magic necklaces off of a cart in the mall, that proves that magic shops should exist in D&D."
 

When you're saying "same economic factors" or "economically indistinguishable" what is it that you mean?

I mean that FRPG magic shops follow the same rules of supply and demand as a RW seller of "magic" and potions.

Because their goods are rare, believed to be effective, and so forth, the RW shop price structure and niche in the economy will be functionally indistinguishable from a FRPG's magic store.

Given analogous societies across the RW/FRPG barrier, the demand for magic is the same. Similarly, the supply of such items will be restricted, especially since- real or fantasy- the knowledge and materials involved in such commerce are not (usually) common.

in addition, the assumption that every DM who permits the sale of magic items in ther campaigns does so based on the modern strip mall/department store model is incorrect. That economic model presumes that magic items are relatively common, so not everybody allows that.

Instead, based on prices alone, most major magic items should be at least as rare as a pretty decent suit of armor- chainmail or better- and craftsmen of that skill are not common.

There are 2 magic item sales models I personally use*:

1) regular merchant who has something magical to sell. He will not have a broad or deep stock of arcane items, and what he has will usually be a magical version of something he would normally sell- so he has some idea of its worth- but he may or may not be aware of its magical nature. Thus, a bargain may be had, but you may also get ripped off...knowingly or unknowingly.

Rarity: well, every merchant has interesting stuff pass in front of them, but some stuff is reserved for only the best or obviously special customers.

2) someone who specializes in the sales of magic items. This may either be a highly specialized store- potions only, weapons & armor only, etc.- or a bit of a generalist, but the proprietor will be knowledgeable as to his stock. His stock will nevertheless be limited- no point using the books as a shopping list- he has what he has, not everything contemplated within the game. If the proprietor is also the one who actually creates the items, there may be the possibility of a custom order. That takes time, though.

Rarity: depends on what he's selling. Potions and similar stuff may be available in even in the rurual areas from the local witch. Bigger cities will support a couple of shops that routinely deal in weapons & armor new-made and/or scavenged from battlefields or tombs- no smaller merchant could afford to do so. Anything of serious power would only be found in the largest of cities, and there may be only 1-2 dealers in such goods in a given country. Nobody openly trades in artifacts, and those who do sell them number in a handful per continent...or world.

In either case, availability is most likeky going to be higher than that of a modern international arms dealer. But even with that model in mind, realize that in any city over a few hundred thousand in the USA, you can find someone willing to sell you a LAW, RPG launcher or bazooka for cash, food stamps and other "currency." No, you won't get to test it, but you can definitely get your hands on illicit military-grade weapons.**









* I do have an Econ degree

** check your local police department reports about weapons seized from intercepted shipments, drug deals, and other raids.
 
Last edited:

Into the Woods

Remove ads

Top