Loaded Dice

[Alzrius]

I say make him eat those dice.

But that said, Janx raises a fair point in that, if nobody else cares enough to make it an issue, the OP will have problems trying to get that player to stop.

 

[Morrus]

How old is this player? Cheating at D&D is pretty... I dunno. Weird.

 

[Vyvyan Basterd]

Morrus is being nice, I'd say more pathetic than weird.

I find the issue quite simple. If it's acquantances, just plainly ask the cheating to stop or you'll find a more mature group. If it's friends, explain that his cheating sucks and you'd like it to stop. If said friend refuses, then he's not much of a friend, go to option 1. In-your-face cheating is ridiculous.

That said, I did have clear evidence of players cheating when I used to run an open game at the local FLGS. ("You rolled all 18s except one and rolled 00 for strength again? Huh.) A friend asked why I hadn't called out one particular cheater. I hadn't even compensated for his cheating like the DM of the OP. This guy was such a bad player he did himself in over and over. I think I might have felt pity for such pathetic actions.

 

[Umbran]

Why shouldn't it be the player's job? They're all part of the same group: it's not as if the DM is responsible for how the group interacts.

Because the GM *is* responsible for how players interact with the rules. The GM has recognized the issue, and put a solution in place to even out the rules issue. So, why is it then the player's job to unilaterally throw that solution out?

The OP might just as easily feel it to be his responsibility to take the DM to task for not dealing with the perceived issue.

But the GM *has* dealt with it - just not in the way the OP finds best.

My view is that if the OP is happy with how the DM is handling the situation, he should ignore it; if he feels that the use of loaded dice and the DM's approach are detracting from his own sense of enjoyment, then he should address the matter, possibly in front of the group as a whole.

There's this thing that helps in human situations, called "diplomacy". I wold recommend the OP consider and use it.

The Golden Rule applies - if the OP (or any of us) were in the GM's seat, would we appreciate the player deciding to go over our heads to the group as a whole over an issue we felt was sufficiently solved? To me, that sounds like a recipe for annoyance, maybe anger, and generally hurt feelings when perhaps none are necessary. Putting it to the group is an act designed specifically to force someone's hand to do what you want, regardless of other concerns. Do you really want to be that manipulative with folks who are supposed to be your friends?

Set aside the "cheating" thing for a moment - the moral connotation there may tend to cover the basic practical consideration of whether everyone is having fun. Is the OP's action in the game being affected? Is spotlight being stolen? Does the cheating player actually win out more often than others? What is the actual functional impact on the OP? So far, none has been stated, and without a functional impact, I'm not sure action is warranted.

 

[was]

How old is this player? Cheating at D&D is pretty... I dunno. Weird.

The guy is 30 plus. He seems to be a nice enough guy, which is why the loaded dice caught me so totally off-guard. Actually, I was the last one of the players to notice. Shows how observant I am. It's not really a mechanics argument. I just think it puts a definite sour note on the gaming experience whe someone is constantly cheating.

 

[frankthedm]

Who's the host, how well does the rest of the group know this cheater? Those are other angles of the social contract. While it offends my sensibilities, maybe the rest of the group feels it is better to let the guy have his dice than have him needing to up his antidepressant dose.

 

[Janx]

Because the GM *is* responsible for how players interact with the rules. The GM has recognized the issue, and put a solution in place to even out the rules issue. So, why is it then the player's job to unilaterally throw that solution out?

Bear in mind, I agree with using diplomacy and having a thought to the extra ramifications if the OP confronts the cheater (like irritating the GM).

However, it's also not just a matter of jobs. Just because the GM chose how HE would react to the situation doesn't grant him authority over how I get to react to the situation. In fact, given that the GM decided what action he was going to take and NOT discussing it with the group is also unilateral decision making.

the GM is the arbiter of the rules, not social disfunction resolution. Cheating in an RPG tends to cause a social problem more than a mechanical one.

I'm no expert at solving the diplomacy problem, but I can smell that it is needed. There's a lot of conflicting social mechanics at work here:

cheating is wrong
talking about someone behind their back is wrong
causing a ruckus in a confrontation is wrong
not doing anything when there is a problem is wrong
not involving the group in a solution when there's a problem is wrong

The GM gets all the rope to solve these problems, when it's not really their job or skillset to wrangle adults into behaving correctly.

I'm wondering if each group needs a table-rule on how to deal with bad behavior at the table. For instance, report suspected behavior problem to GM (he's the common authority figure), and GM brings up the issue in front of the group in a post-game group discussion. At least in this way, everybody knows about the problem, so it's not 4 different conversations about you-know-who going on. And the group is involved in making the decision not just one dude, behind everybody's back.

 

[Morrus]

I'd be concerned. This isn't normal behaviour. A 30+ year old adult man using loaded dice to cheat in a D&D game?

Whoever is closest to this person should investigate the possibility of getting him some professional help. Don't be angry at him; but his behaviour is not something that normal, well- adjusted people do.

This isn't a gaming issue. It's a mental health issue.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

 

[Ahnehnois]

This isn't a gaming issue. It's a mental health issue.

I agree. Dealing with these things is hard, but it does seem to me that a healthy, intelligent adult who understands the game would have to have something going on to do something so blatantly inappropriate.

 

[Stormonu]

I hate cheaters - at anything. I actually kicked out a dice cheater a few years ago. I had long suspected him of cheating, and it was bothering the other players as well (they approached me about it after game). Once day after a rather absurd roll on his part that resulted in an impossible total (something like getting a 39 on 3d10), I called him out on it and told him to leave and not come back.

Countering this though, I've had other players that I'm pretty sure have changed the result of their die rolls during the game. I've let them slide before as they were rolls that were life and death (or damn close) for the character, and it was more dramatic to go with the altered result.

It does strike me as somewhat odd in that there are several DMs who have little or no compunction about changing their own dice results (me being one - I try to be a "dice fall where they may" but sometimes it just doesn't stick), but who won't tolerate players regularly cheating on their rolls.