D&D 5E Where are the PDFs?

[Bugleyman]

I think it is rather funny that you don't think that they have a clue just because you want a PDF.

Do I want PDFs? Absolutely. Me and many, many others. But that isn't why I don't think they have a clue.

I think they don't have a clue because clinging to a dead-tree publishing model in the 21st centurey is clueless. I would have thought the failure of 4E would have made for a sharp lesson. Apparently not.

 

[Umbran]

Releasing a pdf is not a big deal, they have them, they work with them, they sent one to the publisher/printer to make the physical book, taking a couple hours to reduce the file size and put it up for sale on dndclassics.com is not a hard thing, the fact that they haven't done so yet is a stated policy.

Except that a couple of smaller publishers have been on EN World and mentioned that no, that's not how it is done. You can't/don't just turn the print-process pdf into your pdf product offering. The art layout for the print version really isn't appropriate for computer/tablet use, and a proper pdf product needs its own layout - which isn't a trivial thing.

And, the difference is seen in the Basic pdfs - they don't look just like the printed book! To reformat the entire PHB (and other books) in that same way will take some work.

And, by the way, calling people douchey for not doing exactly what you want, when you want it, even though you don't know the business behind it... doesn't make you look like a nice, reasonable guy. Maybe you should resist the urge to do that next time.

And no, a failure to do things on your personal timeline does not a "stated policy" make. Stated policies are characterized by actual *statements* of policy, not inferences from perceptions of consumers.

 

[MerricB]

I think they don't have a clue because clinging to a dead-tree publishing model in the 21st centurey is clueless.

I'm sorry: huh?

For the past several years, Wizards have made a lot of money through the D&D Insider program. They are shortly to launch a program that offers the entire text of the rulebooks in electronic form.

This is not clinging to a "dead tree" model. This is merely not offering up pdfs.

 

[seebs]

I would absolutely buy PDFs. And yes, I already have the hardcover. I'd still buy PDFs. Searchable text is a huge deal for usability.

 

[pkt77242]

Do I want PDFs? Absolutely. Me and many, many others. But that isn't why I don't think they have a clue.

I think they don't have a clue because clinging to a dead-tree publishing model in the 21st centurey is clueless. I would have thought the failure of 4E would have made for a sharp lesson. Apparently not.

Do you have a clue? 70% of all books bought are physical copies. E-books tend to trend younger (18-35 is the biggest consumer of e-books) and as we know D&D has a demographic that is greying. Those are realities. The other truth is that D&D saw something with the PDFs that they sold in 4E that made them not want to do them this time around (could be low sales, massive piracy, both, neither, etc). You are using your wants (and maybe the wants of a few other people that you know) to try and say that many people want PDFs and are willing to pay for them (there is little doubt that many people want PDFs but the amount of them that actually want to pay for it, is completely different) when you don't have the slightest clue if that is accurate on a large scale or not.

 

[Bugleyman]

I'm sorry: huh?

For the past several years, Wizards have made a lot of money through the D&D Insider program. They are shortly to launch a program that offers the entire text of the rulebooks in electronic form.

This is not clinging to a "dead tree" model. This is merely not offering up pdfs.

With all due respect, I'll believe it when I see it. Given the fate of the "Character Visualizer" and the VTT for 4th edition, are you actually going to suggest my skepticism is unwarranted?

If you want to write my opinion off as "rage-quitting," so be it, but I think I'll "merely" send my gaming dollars to companies that produce things I actually want. Which in the case of PDFs, is literally any other RPG publisher.

Who knows, maybe WotC can manage to build themselves another major competitor this time around.

 

[Remathilis]

With all due respect, I'll believe it when I see it. Given the fate of the "Character Visualizer" and the VTT for 4th edition, are you actually going to suggest my skepticism is unwarranted?

If you want to write my opinion off as "rage-quitting," so be it, but I think I'll "merely" send my gaming dollars to companies that produce things I actually want. Which in the case of PDFs, is literally any other RPG publisher.

Who knows, maybe WotC can manage to build themselves another major competitor this time around.

Well, I guess there isn't anything left to discuss. /Thread.

 

[Bugleyman]

Do you have a clue? 70% of all books bought are physical copies. E-books tend to trend younger (18-35 is the biggest consumer of e-books) and as we know D&D has a demographic that is greying. Those are realities. The other truth is that D&D saw something with the PDFs that they sold in 4E that made them not want to do them this time around (could be low sales, massive piracy, both, neither, etc). You are using your wants (and maybe the wants of a few other people that you know) to try and say that many people want PDFs and are willing to pay for them (there is little doubt that many people want PDFs but the amount of them that actually want to pay for it, is completely different) when you don't have the slightest clue if that is accurate on a large scale or not.

Umm...literally the entire industry offers PDFs, except WotC. Do you think they do that because they don't make money?

Look, I get that this is basically a D&D fan site, and people are going to fight the good fight, but come on. PDFs aren't some crazy cutting edge thing any more.

 

[fjw70]

With all due respect, I'll believe it when I see it. Given the fate of the "Character Visualizer" and the VTT for 4th edition, are you actually going to suggest my skepticism is unwarranted?

If you want to write my opinion off as "rage-quitting," so be it, but I think I'll "merely" send my gaming dollars to companies that produce things I actually want. Which in the case of PDFs, is literally any other RPG publisher.

Who knows, maybe WotC can manage to build themselves another major competitor this time around.

Just curious why you don't think the DS ebooks will be an acceptable replacement for PDFs.

 

[Ranes]

Except that a couple of smaller publishers have been on EN World and mentioned that no, that's not how it is done. You can't/don't just turn the print-process pdf into your pdf product offering. The art layout for the print version really isn't appropriate for computer/tablet use, and a proper pdf product needs its own layout - which isn't a trivial thing.

You're absolutely right. It certainly isn't trivial. But smaller publishers are probably living in a different world to WotC. It's relatively cheap and easy to go for digital printing if you want a couple of thousand copies of a book. Once you're into the tens of thousands (or more) of copies of high quality full colour books hundreds of pages long, you're looking at a web-offset printing press and for that to go well you need people experienced in press and you need to take extraordinary care over the processes that go into your PDF preparation. But increasingly, even large publishers do go to print now via PDF (instead of EPS, which was the professional's format of choice when I were a nipper). But at least you have a PDF master.

That's not to say it ends there. If you did want to release a PDF product, I doubt very much whether it would be wise to release the version you'd created for your print company (unless you want to make the counterfeiters' job really easy, never mind the pirates). There'd still be further work to do.