D&D 5E Mike Mearls explaining his view of D&D and how it should be merchandize

[Kramodlog]

Quite interesting. Thanks.

I think its making some strange assumptions though, that D&D players are far more techie and heavily computer aided than they really are and that of course they can get the money they'd spend on steam to be spent on apps? We certainly have tablets and smartphones and laptops galore but they rarely get used and having an app is not better, its actually worse than a sheet of paper in term of utility. We don't really need the official app to make a character sheet and print it out .

I think is people play D&D to be around other people and to not be on the computer so much. It does compete with cards to some degree or at least in did a decade ago but I'm not so sure that is the case now. Anecdotes are not evidence of course but in my gaming circle (a dozen or so with seven regulars) no one is playing any of the collectible card games. The economy has taken such a hit that they regular card churn is just too expensive and provides much lower value than video games. They still buy computer games but its a one time $20 purchase with hundreds of hours of possible play. A trading card game can be fun but its an ongoing expense and a hassle to find players.

Another anecdote, we just got a new FLGS and they carry mostly miniature war games, The people I've seen buying and playing in store were playing Star Wars minis although I suspect that's a fad and it will be replaced with something else, warmachine or whatever is hot in a few months. At least though the money you spent has some artistic value, you can collect X wings or the Falcon or re-purpose miniatures for D&D . You cant resell, re-purpose or reuse apps

Now I kind of agree that D&D competes with the computer for time but I really don't think that it is the same market or hobby or that anyone really needs a ton of software or will buy it. WOTC would IMNSHO be much smarter in releasing a traditional mix of adventures and splat books in print and later PDF.

And I think Mearls is right and wrong on splat books. A lot of them don't get used but people actually enjoy reading about them and daydreaming about options and such. They may never play X,Y,or Zed splat but that doesn't matter, This sells books and the excitement moves product or at least that's the conventional wisdom

My fear is that this push for "bigger money" monetizing software and selling IP and ignoring the tabletop hobby will simply put D&D into a coma. Even with brand recognition, without new releases, the urge to play is smaller and expensive adventures which sell one per group if that aren't going to cut it. A lot of people like to DIY for their own game worlds and whatever stuff WOTC has this week may not cut it, Splat books OTOH are more adaptable.

That said I might be wrong and if so, hope they make a bundle. They just won't bet getting my money.

From info Ryan Dancey gave, there were two moments when RPGs were hit by competing games. The first was in the late 90s caused by tactical war games. The Collectable Card Game craze was a modest hit, contrary to popular beliefs. Only 10% loss.

The other hit was in 2004 when World of Warcraft arrived. Sells dropped. A lot. So we know that there is some overlap between RPGamers and Video gamers. Doing all these apps and video games is probably to reach those gamers who layed the game but left. So they are familiar with the brand name and might make the purchase.

I think that info was in [video=youtube;ZXLBBp3YDro]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXLBBp3YDro[/video], but it could be from the video in the thread with Mike Mearls' name in the tile.

 

[BryonD]

I agree with some of his points. But he also seems to be arguing against himself as well (granted that may be in part due to my Feb 2015 perspective).

For example, don't publish as much because it is about the larger market of entertainment. (They alluded to this a few times, and I've already stated that I think this is a key part of the current strategy, for better or worse)
So this is why they publish less gaming books because fans don't want to tinker, they want to play.

But 12-year old Mike spent his time building car wars cars and 2014 Mike would rather play an app on his phone.
Which one of those Mikes wants to build the new Sorcerer options and which one wants to grab it to plug into his game tomorrow?

 

[Eirikrautha]

If the employees are getting paid, fans are getting books, and the company is in the black then why does it need to make millions? If they net a 100 dollars it's still a profit.

So you are contending that Hasbro & WotC have not made a profit? Not even $100? Because if they have, then they are "doing well" (according to YOUR OWN definition). Which totally invalidates your original complaint. Which was my point.

 

[BryonD]

The other hit was in 2004 when World of Warcraft arrived. Sells dropped. A lot. So we know that there is some overlap between RPGamers and Video gamers.

Kinda-sorta

I think the great majority of that overlap is defined as this: If you are a WoW player and it is 1977, you are playing D&D because it is the closest thing to WoW that actually exists.

To me this is a significant difference because overlap and competing for market share is one thing, and simply becoming obsolete to a portion of the market is quite another.

Obviously there are a lot of people who truly do overlap and are part of the market for both. And most of those have limited budgets so there is some degree of competition.

But I think it is substantially less than a simple before and after comparison would lead one to conclude.

 

[Galendril]

I know from my own personal experience that I stopped looking for D&D groups once Everquest came out.

 

[SkidAce]

I know from my own personal experience that I stopped looking for D&D groups once Everquest came out.

Yeah, slaying monsters and RP and grouping....without any prep? It hit us hard and ate into our gaming time also.

Ahhh, Lake of Ill Omen, just as real to us as the Sea of Fallen Stars.

 

[Ace]

From info Ryan Dancey gave, there were two moments when RPGs were hit by competing games. The first was in the late 90s caused by tactical war games. The Collectable Card Game craze was a modest hit, contrary to popular beliefs. Only 10% loss.

The other hit was in 2004 when World of Warcraft arrived. Sells dropped. A lot. So we know that there is some overlap between RPGamers and Video gamers. Doing all these apps and video games is probably to reach those gamers who layed the game but left. So they are familiar with the brand name and might make the purchase.

I think that info was in [video=youtube;ZXLBBp3YDro]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXLBBp3YDro[/video], but it could be from the video in the thread with Mike Mearls' name in the tile.

That sounds reasonable but what would the apps actually do? WoW or predecessor Everquest (affectionately known as ever-crack in these parts) allowed people to do hack and slash D&D anywhere without other players or with them and without prep. Online tools are unlikely to provide the same experience unless of course they are pushing Neverwinter or whatever the official version is now. I don't know anyone who plays that but it was a big hit and in truth though my group is young (20's) they are throwbacks in some ways.

That said it does seem that WOTC is a bit starved for resources being Hasbro's red headed stepchild, job #1 is not to cater to the fragmented TTRPG market but to maximize the brands revenue with what resources they have. I don't like it but it makes sense.

 

[Kramodlog]

That sounds reasonable but what would the apps actually do? WoW or predecessor Everquest (affectionately known as ever-crack in these parts) allowed people to do hack and slash D&D anywhere without other players or with them and without prep. Online tools are unlikely to provide the same experience unless of course they are pushing Neverwinter or whatever the official version is now. I don't know anyone who plays that but it was a big hit and in truth though my group is young (20's) they are throwbacks in some ways.

That is the question, isn't. Trapdoor was making one. Probably requiring a monthly subscription. Not sure what it did, but was an app. I guess after that you go into games that you pay with. Have Drizzt slash stuff thrown at him. Elmister fly and peeks at women undressing (he is a perv), etc.

People do not need to play with those games or like them. They just need to buy them. A lot of games on Steam are impulve buy and require micro-paiments. It would make sense to go in that direction.

Still, not sure you'll get tone of cash out of it. Maybe with novels, comics, t-shirts, plushies, minis, board games, spell cards and DM screens, you make lots of money.

That said it does seem that WOTC is a bit starved for resources being Hasbro's red headed stepchild, job #1 is not to cater to the fragmented TTRPG market but to maximize the brands revenue with what resources they have. I don't like it but it makes sense.

It is a gamble. The RPG as more garantied revenues, but we do not know what are WotC/Hasbro's expectations for a brand. Just a RPG could be profitable, but might not meet set goals and expectations.

 

[Shasarak]

Generating these tools is hard, time-consuming work. So when the guys you've got doing the job for you prove to be unsuited to the task (for any reason) and you have to start over, that means a big delay.

(And the fact that a few people banged out fan-made generators quickly isn't terribly relevant - there's a world of difference between something put out at zero or low cost for a few people to mess around with and with no great expectations, versus a polished product intended for sale to tens of thousands of picky fans.)

Damn those programs for being simultaneously hard and time-consuming while being easy to bang out.

 

[TerraDave]

His actions don't really follow his words in this case... so far.

I remember this one. Dancy talks way too much. And there is an irony in Mearls comments. 5E D&D right now is very user friendly, especially for DMs that want to homebrew or convert a bunch of material...and both players and DMs can get very immersive with it if they choose. Its a great way to kill hours over weeks over months over years. Like other editions of D&D.

But other then looking at the basic rules (again!), there is no phone ap. And outside the nice starter set, with its adventure that allows for hours of play, no real quick entry point.

Nor has any been announced. But I guess, so far...