D&D 5E How many fans want a 5E Warlord?

[Tony Vargas]

No reason it has to be 1 option.

There's room for at-will dice, healer feat, inspiring leader feat, and battle plans. Particularly if the battle plan needs dice to use.

Though, the inspirational healing would need to be bumped into sub-class at that point, unless something else was cut.

I see no need for that. As long as there are alternate choices for how to use inspiration, it could be part of the the main class.

For instance, the warlord might have an Inspiring Word feature in the main class. The basic ways to use it might be Rallying Inspiration (in-combat, restores hps), Bolstering Inspiration (in/out- combat, grants a save or save bonus), and Inspiring Speech (out-of-combat, grants temps). The resource on each of these would be the subjects, themselves. An ally can only reach so deep, so often, to exceed his limits. Maybe once between rests, maybe a CON or WIS save to benefit a second time between rests, with the DC rising each time (which'd make the ability neatly scale, with the level of the ally - conversely, the actual benefits could be based on the level of the Warlord).

Different archetypes might add to that. The Bravura could add an offensive-buff use of inspiration. The 'lazy' type (I'd like to call it "Icon," because it just has to be there, not necessarily do much), could inspire a surge of effort like an Action Surge (probably not quite as potent). Etc.

Some maneuvers might also count as a use of Inspiration.

Something like that would strike me as having a little more verisimilitude than an x/interval limitation on the ability, itself, or an arbitrary dice pool.

I'm actually really starting to like this idea, in conjunction with the warlord having Tactics that are limited by the situation and whether the ally can has seen them before, or can see through them (INT save).

 

[Remathilis]

Cool.

Same answer: There's a number of Warlord Paragon Paths that could make interesting PrCs.

Given 5e's tighter level range, Epic Destinies might not be out of the question as PrCs, either, depending on the tone the DM chooses for the higher levels of play.

Actually, that might be a way to satisfy the diversity of opinion on warlords: multiple support Prestige classes. For example:

Battle-Captain: Good at giving allies aura-buffs
Inspiring Marshal: a healer who taps into inspiration and bardic-magicky stuff to heal with his voice
Knight-Commander: All about tactical maneuvers and extra actions

You could set them as low as 3rd level and they can be entered from fighter, paladin, rogue, and stack them to mix-and-match the warlord you want.

 

[Aldarc]

Let s just make a class who can heal same as cleric, but non-magical, do damage same as fighter, have inspirations and skills like bard, Help as a free action with 300 yards range and have battlemasters maneuvers with 9 superior dice regenerating per round where every maneuver cast time is "one attack", making it able to use 3 maneuvers per round at level 11.
Only way to stop these threads where people want everything the best on one class 24/7 cause why not.

Perhaps you would engage in less disingenuous hyperbole if you bothered to listen to pro-warlord fans instead of inventing such strawman positions out of thin air.

 

[mellored]

I see no need for that. As long as there are alternate choices for how to use inspiration, it could be part of the the main class.

Well one of them needs to be bumped.

Keep inspiration and bump the healer feat into a sub-class?'

For instance, the warlord might have an Inspiring Word feature in the main class. The basic ways to use it might be Rallying Inspiration (in-combat, restores hps), Bolstering Inspiration (in/out- combat, grants a save or save bonus), and Inspiring Speech (out-of-combat, grants temps). The resource on each of these would be the subjects, themselves. An ally can only reach so deep, so often, to exceed his limits. Maybe once between rests, maybe a CON or WIS save to benefit a second time between rests, with the DC rising each time (which'd make the ability neatly scale, with the level of the ally - conversely, the actual benefits could be based on the level of the Warlord).

Hmm... HD is a universal resource.

"As a bonus action you can inspire an ally with one of the following. They may choose to spend a hit die and gain the bonus instead of hit points. Allies who do not spend hit dice gain no bonus. Allies may benefit from 1 inspiration at a time.

*Fight On: Allies gain hit points equal to their HD + your Cha modifier.
*Onward to Glory: Allies gain temporary hit points equal to twice HD.
*On Guard: The next time the ally is hit, turn it into a miss, or 1 critical hit into a normal hit.
*RARRR!!!: The next time the ally attacks, turn a miss into a hit, or turn hit into a critical hit. A roll of 1 remains a miss.
"

Edit: Though there should be some cap to prevent multi-classing dips.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

Cool.

Same answer: There's a number of Warlord Paragon Paths that could make interesting PrCs.

Given 5e's tighter level range, Epic Destinies might not be out of the question as PrCs, either, depending on the tone the DM chooses for the higher levels of play.

Yeah, I'm not sure what exactly PRCs change here. I think it would be possible to model a 'warlord' (or a variety of characters of the general type) using the PRC rules, but I'm not exactly sure why it should be a PRC and not just a regular base class. That is to say PRCs are 'niche' concepts, classes that do only one thing or fill a specific space within a setting, extend existing concepts in a slightly new direction, etc.

For instance the Rune Scribe class depicted as an example clearly is intended to extend casting to a slightly different paradigm. I guess a fighter could become a Rune Scribe, but there wouldn't be much point since he has no existing spell slots to power complex rune properties (and you don't need to be a scribe to use simple ones). He'd get a few spell slots from the PRC, but a wizard (for example) would get a LOT more use out of the class. So its a niche concept that allows for a variant sort of 'casting' and might well be used to portray a specific sort of magical tradition (say one of Dwarves or just a secret cabal of Rune Scribes with specific goals).


In the case of a warlord why wouldn't a character simply pursue it as a full-time vocation?

I think discussion of the overall PRC concept presented here is a bit OT, but it seems like one of those ideas that some people may find useful but isn't really needed that much in 5e.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Actually, that might be a way to satisfy the diversity of opinion on warlords: multiple support Prestige classes.

The Warlord class, itself, should simply have archetypes to cover the range of concepts people might want to play. Bravura (more 'tank' and lead-from the front), Tactical (more out-maneuvering the enemy, buffs, & shading into control), Inspiring (more hp restoration, temps, & saves), Icon (sounds better than 'lazy,' more inspiring just by being there, action granting), &c

Battle-Captain: Good at giving allies aura-buffs
Inspiring Marshal: a healer who taps into inspiration and bardic-magicky stuff to heal with his voice
Knight-Commander: All about tactical maneuvers and extra actions

Ideal if you want actual rank, membership in a hierarchy, or more specific specializations, yes. Right up the PrC mechanic's alley.

Edit:PrCs would also be a good place to sequester 'plot coupon' style mechanics that give players input into the plot, situations & NPCs, thus more directly influencing the story in 'author stance.' A 'Fated Hero' (your 'deed' is to get 'marked by Fate' somehow, maybe fulfilling a prophesy?) for instance.

You could even come at them from other classes than just Warlord. A Paladin Knight-Commander, a Valor-Bard Inspiring Marshal, a Battle-MasterCaptain (any non-Caster for the 'Fated Hero'). Assuming you could get the preqs, 'just so,' they might not even require you to pull in that 1st level of Warlord.

 

[mellored]

Actually, that might be a way to satisfy the diversity of opinion on warlords: multiple support Prestige classes. For example:

Battle-Captain: Good at giving allies aura-buffs
Inspiring Marshal: a healer who taps into inspiration and bardic-magicky stuff to heal with his voice
Knight-Commander: All about tactical maneuvers and extra actions

You could set them as low as 3rd level and they can be entered from fighter, paladin, rogue, and stack them to mix-and-match the warlord you want.

I personally would be ok with this.

But, i personally would be ok if they made every class that way.

 

[Tony Vargas]

I think discussion of the overall PRC concept presented here is a bit OT, but it seems like one of those ideas that some people may find useful but isn't really needed that much in 5e.

Sure, it's mostly off-topic. But, it does show that 5e is moving closer to 3.x in terms of expanding player options - and the risk of 'bloat' & 'power creep' that entails. It weakens the idea that nothing must be allowed to be added to the game, so as to preserve it's 'simplicity.'

 

[Tony Vargas]

Well one of them needs to be bumped.

Keep inspiration and bump the healer feat into a sub-class?'

Healer feat? Uh, sure, if the Warlord must include a bonus feat, bump it down to an archetype. Healer into er 'Icon' maybe, the other archetypes could get different feats if there's enough to go around. Inspiring, well, Inspiring Leader, Bravura, Sentinel, Tactical? Is there a remotely Tactical feat?

Does any extant class grant a specific feat?

Hmm... HD is a universal resource.

"As a bonus action you can inspire an ally with one of the following. They may choose to spend a hit die and gain the bonus instead of hit points. Allies who do not spend hit dice gain no bonus. Allies may benefit from 1 inspiration at a time.

*Fight On: Allies gain hit points equal to their HD + your Cha modifier.
*Onward to Glory: Allies gain temporary hit points equal to twice HD.
*On Guard: The next time the ally is hit, turn it into a miss, or 1 critical hit into a normal hit.
*RARRR!!!: The next time the ally attacks, turn a miss into a hit, or turn hit into a critical hit. A roll of 1 remains a miss.
"

Edit: Though there should be some cap to prevent multi-classing dips.

Yes, the more I think about it, the more it seems reasonable for a lot of Warlord abilities to work based on the Warlord's level for some things, the ally level for others, or even the lower of the two. For typical parties, it would barely matter, but for parties using lower-level henchmen, doing the old 'train the villagers to defend themselves' thing, or with a higher-level NPC tagging along for some reason, it could be an important consideration.

 

[Remathilis]

The Warlord class, itself, should simply have archetypes. Bravura (more 'tank' and lead-from the front), Tactical (more out-maneuvering the enemy, buffs, & shading into control), Inspiring (more hp restoration, temps, & saves), Icon (sounds better than 'lazy,' more inspiring just by being there, action granting), &c

Ideal if you want actual rank, membership in a hierarchy, or more specific specializations, yes. Right up the PrC mechanic's alley.

You could even come at them from other classes than just Warlord. A Paladin Knight-Commander, a Valor-Bard Inspiring Marshal, a Battle-MasterCaptain. Assuming you could get the preqs, 'just so,' they might not even require you to pull in that 1st level of Warlord.

I'm talking about INSTEAD OF a 20 level warlord class, have a couple of prestige classes that emulate warlord abilities with low requisites that can custom mix-and-match. You'd take a few levels in a PHB class, then go into a warlordish prestige class. If you haven't read the PrC/Rune caster UA up today and check out what I'm talking about.

I'm wagering from your answer though, it would probably not be a suitable replacement for a 20-level warlord, so I'll drop it and move on.