D&D 5E Points of Light setting and current cross-over strategy: Round peg in the square hole.

[Jester David]

So is [MENTION=6776548]Corpsetaker[/MENTION]. But you seem to think it matters that Corpsetaker says stuff that is mistaken! (And he's talking about stuff quite a bit more obscure than what you were - the Elder Elemental Eye and his demented followers is called out in the 4e MM (p 52, in the sidebar "The Birth of the Abyss" - hardly an obscure reference.)

Man, even when I was running 4e I barely cracked open the Monster Manual. Can't say I've bothered to look at it much in the six years since I stopped.

 

[Corpsetaker]

Incorrect. Forgotten Realms Adventures (the 1e to 2e transition book) included the spell Khelben's warding whip, which is specifically designed to counter the various Bigby's ______ hand spells, and the description mentions that apperently the two have run into one another on less-than-friendly terms, and that Khelben thinks Bigby is being obnoxious with his one gimmick. The book also mentions "it is known that Mordenkainen and Vangerdahast both competed magically for the hand of a young extra-planar beauty (both lost, by the way)." Also, For Duty and Deity (an adventure where the PCs are supposed to rescue Waukeen from her imprisonment at Graz'zt's hands) mentions that Waukeen's domain on the Outlands is the Marketplace Eternal, which she shares with Shinare of Krynn, Zilchus of Oerth, and Sera of Aebrynis (Birthright). You also have Count Gamalon Idogyr, Court Sage of Tethyr. He spent 30-some years on the Rock of Bral before returning to his native Tethyr. Since you have the Rock of Bral connected to the official Realms, you also connect the wider Spelljammer universe to it, including places like Oerth and Krynn.

Just thought I would post this because reading the whole thing is important than just a snippet. "Welcome to For Duty & Deity, an adventure that will take high level Forgotten Realms characters far beyond their familiar home of Toril to the infinite layers of the Abyss. There they must rescue the imprisoned Faerûnian goddess of trade, Waukeen, from the clutches of the demon lord Grazzt. Then, of course, they must escape from the Abyss, likely with various demons or tanar'ri, as they are known on the planes in hot pursuit. If they succeed, they will have the gratitude of a goddess; if they fail, their bodies and minds will become the playthings of Grazzt. A quick death in battle may be the least unpleasant outcome the characters can hope for in the latter circumstances. This adventure differs in several ways from standard Realms adventures and therefore requires more explanation than such adventures. With the exception of the opening scene, the events of this scenario do not occur on the planet Abeir-Toril, or even on the Prime Material Plane. Characters will be introduced to the concept of the plane-spanning Infinite Staircase and use it to reach the Abyss. The Infinite Staircase appears not only in this adventure but also in the PLANESCAPE adventure anthology Tales from the Infinite Staircase (TSR 2632), by Monte Cook. Unlike the linked FORGOTTEN REALMS scenario Castle Spulzeer (TSR 9544) and the RAVENLOFT adventure The Forgotten Terror (TSR 9537), the Tales anthology of adventures and this product are not literal crossover products. The two products do not directly affect or interact with each other. They are complimentary, however. While enough information is presented here on the Infinite Staircase to allow the Realms characters to use it to reach the Abyss (and, hopefully, to return therefrom), the full wonders of the Staircase can be found only in the Tales product. Those groups intrigued by the Staircase concept are encouraged to seek out and use the scenarios and plots in that book and adapt them for use. Even though the Tales anthology suggests characters of levels notably lower than those required for this adventure, bear in mind that the average Realms character may not possess the same degree of knowledge that an experienced planewalker character might. Thus, the extra spells, hit points, and so on of the higher-level Realms characters used here could come in handy. Furthermore, while this adventure takes place on the Outer Planes in the Abyss, to be exact For Duty & Deity is not a PLANESCAPE adventure. Though it uses many of the rules that the PLANESCAPE accessories have established for running adventures on other planes of existence, this remains a scenario that involves primematerial characters and a prime-material point of view. (If PLANESCAPE groups wish to use this adventure, a brief alternate beginning is presented as part of the next chapter, Call of the Lost Goddess.) The relevant statistics for all creatures and conditions encountered are presented within the adventure itself, including MCstyle entries on three especially significant creatures. Though other accessories are not necessary for play, DMs who wish for further information can find more details on the Abyss in the PLANESCAPE boxed set Planes & Chaos. Also, most of the creatures found in this adventure are located in one of the two PLANESCAPE MONSTROUS COMPENDIUM appendices (TSR 2602 and 2613, respectively).

 

[Tony Vargas]

No, maybe you would have been better off, but it is pretty clear that their plan is working very well for them. I don't think they would have been better off using PoL.

To be clear, PoL is the only D&D setting I ever got invested in over my 30 years of playing, and I don't think it would be a good thing for WotC to use that setting as their starting point.

It's not even really a setting, it's a generic suggestion of a setting, and, while there /is/ an associated cosmology that's pretty cool, it's mostly, as the name implies, a type - a 'dark ages' sort of vibe, where the ancient empires have fallen. D&D often featured long-vanished empires in a number of settins, it's just also featured very together societies in the nominal present. There was (at least meant to be) less of that in PoL, and less of the uber-NPCs that might imply, giving the world more of a need for the PCs to be heroes.

 

[Parmandur]

Just thought I would post this because reading the whole thing is important than just a snippet. "Welcome to For Duty & Deity, an adventure that will take high level Forgotten Realms characters far beyond their familiar home of Toril to the infinite layers of the Abyss. There they must rescue the imprisoned Faerûnian goddess of trade, Waukeen, from the clutches of the demon lord Grazzt. Then, of course, they must escape from the Abyss, likely with various demons or tanar'ri, as they are known on the planes in hot pursuit. If they succeed, they will have the gratitude of a goddess; if they fail, their bodies and minds will become the playthings of Grazzt. A quick death in battle may be the least unpleasant outcome the characters can hope for in the latter circumstances. This adventure differs in several ways from standard Realms adventures and therefore requires more explanation than such adventures. With the exception of the opening scene, the events of this scenario do not occur on the planet Abeir-Toril, or even on the Prime Material Plane. Characters will be introduced to the concept of the plane-spanning Infinite Staircase and use it to reach the Abyss. The Infinite Staircase appears not only in this adventure but also in the PLANESCAPE adventure anthology Tales from the Infinite Staircase (TSR 2632), by Monte Cook. Unlike the linked FORGOTTEN REALMS scenario Castle Spulzeer (TSR 9544) and the RAVENLOFT adventure The Forgotten Terror (TSR 9537), the Tales anthology of adventures and this product are not literal crossover products. The two products do not directly affect or interact with each other. They are complimentary, however. While enough information is presented here on the Infinite Staircase to allow the Realms characters to use it to reach the Abyss (and, hopefully, to return therefrom), the full wonders of the Staircase can be found only in the Tales product. Those groups intrigued by the Staircase concept are encouraged to seek out and use the scenarios and plots in that book and adapt them for use. Even though the Tales anthology suggests characters of levels notably lower than those required for this adventure, bear in mind that the average Realms character may not possess the same degree of knowledge that an experienced planewalker character might. Thus, the extra spells, hit points, and so on of the higher-level Realms characters used here could come in handy. Furthermore, while this adventure takes place on the Outer Planes in the Abyss, to be exact For Duty & Deity is not a PLANESCAPE adventure. Though it uses many of the rules that the PLANESCAPE accessories have established for running adventures on other planes of existence, this remains a scenario that involves primematerial characters and a prime-material point of view. (If PLANESCAPE groups wish to use this adventure, a brief alternate beginning is presented as part of the next chapter, Call of the Lost Goddess.) The relevant statistics for all creatures and conditions encountered are presented within the adventure itself, including MCstyle entries on three especially significant creatures. Though other accessories are not necessary for play, DMs who wish for further information can find more details on the Abyss in the PLANESCAPE boxed set Planes & Chaos. Also, most of the creatures found in this adventure are located in one of the two PLANESCAPE MONSTROUS COMPENDIUM appendices (TSR 2602 and 2613, respectively).

So, yeah: multiverse, established: just like Perkins, Greenwood, Senett & co.who are in charge of what counts as canon say these days. Thanks?

 

[TwoSix]

What level spell was wall of text back in the Planescape days?

 

[dave2008]

It's not even really a setting, it's a generic suggestion of a setting, and, while there /is/ an associated cosmology that's pretty cool, it's mostly, as the name implies, a type - a 'dark ages' sort of vibe, where the ancient empires have fallen. D&D often featured long-vanished empires in a number of settins, it's just also featured very together societies in the nominal present. There was (at least meant to be) less of that in PoL, and less of the uber-NPCs that might imply, giving the world more of a need for the PCs to be heroes.

All very true. What I also like about the cosmology / history is that it was mostly implied to hearsay with differing opinions. It really gave you the freedom to make it what you wanted it to be.

 

[Prism]

Just for a bit of current reference from a recent novel. Death Masks written by Ed Greenwood includes Elminster as you can imagine but also a detailed storyline about Mordenkainen from Oerth in none other than Waterdeep (basically him and El are old friends). I think its fairly true to say that Ed has no problems connecting at least these to primes together.

 

[Parmandur]

All very true. What I also like about the cosmology / history is that it was mostly implied to hearsay with differing opinions. It really gave you the freedom to make it what you wanted it to be.

Yeah, it was a decent idea; but given the break-neck pace of releases, kind of hard to maintain that vagueness. Also how B/X simple example continent became an involved setting all of its own.

 

[Parmandur]

Just for a bit of current reference from a recent novel. Death Masks written by Ed Greenwood includes Elminster as you can imagine but also a detailed storyline about Mordenkainen from Oerth in none other than Waterdeep (basically him and El are old friends). I think its fairly true to say that Ed has no problems connecting at least these to primes together.

Yeah, Greenwood referencing old Greenwood; not really sure how anything gets more canon than that?

Isn't there a secret spaceport in Undermountain or something, for interstellar smuggling (including to Oerth and Krynn?)?

 

[Jester David]

Yeah, Greenwood referencing old Greenwood; not really sure how anything gets more canon than that?

Isn't there a secret spaceport in Undermountain or something, for interstellar smuggling (including to Oerth and Krynn?)?

Stardock. I referenced it earlier. Infamous for being the final TSR product pre-WotC buyout.