I find these two examples to be nothing alike. You are equating being able to see everything around the invisible statue, to being blind and not seeing anything in the room at all. No wonder you flat out disallow your PC their chances. You relate scenarios to extreme, exaggerated conditions until it fits your desire to zero out any possibility.If you walk into a room (and don't walk into the thing) I think it would be virtually impossible to detect an invisible statue unless you interact with it somehow in many (not all) cases. It would be no different than if I blindfolded you, took you into a room you had never been in and asked you to describe where all the furniture was. Unless you're DareDevil it's not going to happen.
I find these two examples to be nothing alike. You are equating being able to see everything around the invisible statue, to being blind and not seeing anything in the room at all. No wonder you flat out disallow your PC their chances. You relate scenarios to extreme, exaggerated conditions until it fits your desire to zero out any possibility.
Virtually impossible = DC 30 (stealth check) vs pc's perception.If you walk into a room (and don't walk into the thing) I think it would be virtually impossible to detect an invisible statue unless you interact with it somehow in many (not all) cases.
Nevermind. The goalpost is moving around so fast I've lost track of it completely.There's a 2 foot tall invisible lawn gnome statue on an otherwise clean shelf.
How could you possibly notice it unless you happen to bump into it?
- No dust, no cobwebs, the shelf is not bending under the weight of the statue, nothing.
- You don't have a bat's sonar.
- You don't have keen enough hearing to hear the air molecules bouncing off of it.
- It doesn't have a unique smell, it's not making any noise.
- It's not sparking magic gnome dust to give away it's position.
- Its' a clean room and there's not enough dust floating in the air to give away it's position
- There's no pigeon sitting on top of it, no spider crawling over it or anything else
But my answer included examples that ran the gamut, from being undetectable without special abilities to it being obvious there was something you couldn't see with options in between. The undetectable statue is just one possibility of many.
I don't understand why it bothers you that there's a chance the DM may show some creativity and think about how people would perceive the world around them.
The "invisible object in the room" has featured in more than one game I've played, and is a pretty common trope of fantasy/sci-fi/comics.
It's also off topic of creatures running around in combat turning invisible, and is something simply not covered by the rules. When the rules are silent, I use my best judgement. I can't think of anything else to add.
Virtually impossible = DC 30 (stealth check) vs pc's perception.
We're talking about heros here... nothing is virtually impossible... hard maybe.. but you as a DM has to set the difficulty for the pc's to overcome everything.
Actually, the book says the DM decides if a roll is necessary.
Nevermind. The goalpost is moving around so fast I've lost track of it completely.
I find these two examples to be nothing alike. You are equating being able to see everything around the invisible statue, to being blind and not seeing anything in the room at all. No wonder you flat out disallow your PC their chances. You relate scenarios to extreme, exaggerated conditions until it fits your desire to zero out any possibility.
I have a player in my home game who has a passive perception of 30 (rogue/cleric +5 proficiency +5 expertise +5 observant +5 sentinel shield). He still doesn't have sonar, nor automatic see invisible.
You mean the invisible figurine on a shelf in a hospital?How so? I stated there was an invisible statue in a room...