D&D 5E Need help with vehicle carrying capacity

[Charlaquin]

So, in general, the rule seems to be is that an animal pulling a vehicle can pull up to 5x its carrying capacity, including the weight of the vehicle. If multiple animals pull the same vehicle, they add their capacities together. I like that; it's simple, it's easy to use, and it's consistent with the carrying capacity rules (5x capacity being the amount a creature can drag). But, the problem I'm running into is that there are no guidelines for how much weight a vehicle can hold. Sure, one could say that the vehicle's carrying capacity is irrelevant, all that matters is if the animal can pull it all or not. Except, a cart (for example) weighs less than a wagon. So by RAW, you can technically carry more in a wagon than a cart, since the wagon itself weighs less and therefore takes up less of the animal's carrying capacity. So why would anyone ever use a wagon over a cart? It costs more, and technically can't carry as much.

Are there maybe rules on this from an earlier edition I could borrow? Or does anyone have a house rule on vehicle carrying capacities that has worked in there games? Does anyone have untested suggestions for how to handle this? Much appreciated if so.

 

[aco175]

You could base something on the number of wheels. A cart typically has 2 wheels and a wagon has 4. I could see the wagon being able to handle 2x the weight. You could also scale it and make it 6x or something, but I like to keep D&D simple and may just go with 2x.

I may just make something based on the size of the cart or wagon. Some are too big for one horse, or need 4 to work. Some may be sized for elephants or such and scale like that. Start with a basic cart for one horse and make the weight fit. Also, a donkey pulling a cart is going to be different than a draft horse, but would the cart itself be able to handle a larger load even if the animal could not move it. I would go with something simple;

cart- 1 ton
wagon, small- 2 ton (1 or 2 horse)
wagon, lg- 4 ton (2 horse)
wagon, great- 8 ton (4 horse)

I googled this and found a few other 5e threads asking the same, but did not find much in terms of answers. You can also have them carry as much as plot demands.

 

[Harzel]

cart- 1 ton
wagon, small- 2 ton (1 or 2 horse)
wagon, lg- 4 ton (2 horse)
wagon, great- 8 ton (4 horse)

This seems high by at least 2x. Average-ish pickup trucks have payload capacity ~ 1 ton.

 

[Bacon Bits]

Just do some research. According to Wikipedia, the Conestoga wagon could carry up to 6 tons (Note: As of Nov 2020, Wikipedia says 3 tons, but the linked reference still says 6 tons. I'm not somewhere I can edit Wikipedia or I'd correct the vandalism), but it was a much heavier wagon than most covered wagons.

I would say that each vehicle is built for a certain number of animals, and adding more doesn't increase the capacity anymore.

For example: A cart is built for one animal. A wagon for two (basic or passenger) or four (heavy). Adding further animals might allow faster travel or advantage on exhaustion or vehicle checks involving difficult train.

 

[Hussar]

Just a question. Does it matter? I'm totally not meaning to be a smart ass here. No snark. But, why do you need to know? It might be easier to simply say, "The vehicle carries with the strength of plot."

 

[SkidAce]

Just a question. Does it matter? I'm totally not meaning to be a smart ass here. No snark. But, why do you need to know? It might be easier to simply say, "The vehicle carries with the strength of plot."

I understand the reason they asked.

Something semi realistic they can gauge and be consistent with. Helps the DM adjudicate.

It would bother me a little if I found out my cart was carrying the same amount as river barge could, so a guesstimate for consistency is always a good starting point.

And then, if for some reason "the cart" the characters are dealing with gets full....or they find a dragon hoard...there are reasonable "guidelines"

"Well Bob, looks like we will need a bigger boat...."

 

[Ilbranteloth]

A simple way would be to use the same capacities.

For example, a cart designed to be hauled by one horse/mule has a capacity that matches the animal it's designed for.

A wagon designed for two horses is twice as much.

The reverse is also true, the cart is designed to only accommodate one animal. So if you want to increase your hauling capacity to 2 or more animals, you need a wagon.

I think this is true as well. The way a typical cart is designed, there are two poles (one on either side of the horse). This is necessary to balance the load on the horse. Since there are only two wheels, steering is accomplished by turning the entire cart.

Whereas a wagon has a steerable front set of wheels, with a center beam that goes between a team of two or more horses. This doesn't even have to be a solid beam that's permanently connected to the wagon. You could design a cart that would work for two horses, but it's probably more practical to switch to a wagon at that point.

Another factor that comes to mind is there's probably a limit to the usable size of a cart. Since there aren't front wheels, the horse(s) hold the load up in addition to pulling it. With a wagon, all of their effort is in pulling it.

There's little reason to design a larger wagon that will only be hauled by two horses, as the extra weight of the wagon will offset any gain in capacity (unless your cargo is bulky but light). Otherwise you'd have wagons designed for two horses, four horses, and possibly more.

Technically, the weight of the cart/wagon wouldn't increase the same amount as the capacity. If you're concerned about that, consider that the increase in weight of the vehicle itself is a percentage of the increase as a whole. Perhaps 50% less when designing for a second animal, and 50% less again for the second pair.

Of course, people purchase better technology (wagon vs. cart) for other reasons. The ride is smoother in a wagon since it's riding on 4 wheels instead of 2 wheels and bouncing on the back of the animal up front. The wagon naturally remains level when disconnected from the animals, and it's probably easier to hook up a team to the harness of a wagon as well.

So assuming a draft horse, the options available would be:
1-horse cart is 200 lbs. with a capacity of 340 lbs.
2-horse wagon is 400 lbs. with a capacity of 640 lbs.
4 horse wagon is 600 lbs. with a capacity of 1,560 lbs.

There would be no need to design the cart/wagon to carry more than the intended animal is capable of hauling.

 

[Ganymede81]

Wagons are significantly more luxurious.

 

[Charlaquin]

So assuming a draft horse, the options available would be:
1-horse cart is 200 lbs. with a capacity of 340 lbs.
2-horse wagon is 400 lbs. with a capacity of 640 lbs.
4 horse wagon is 600 lbs. with a capacity of 1,560 lbs.

No, see, assuming a draft horse, which has a base carrying capacity of 540, which is multiplied by 5 when it’s pulling a vehicle, for a total of 2,700, times the number of horses, minus the weight of the vehicle. That means the oprions are
1-horse cart is 200 lbs. with a capacity of 2,500 lbs.
1-horse sled is 300 lbs. with a capacity of 2,400 lbs. for 5 gold more so why would you ever want one.
2-horse wagon is 400 lbs. with a capacity of 5,000 lbs.
2-horse chariot is 100 lbs. with a capacity of 5,300 lbs. for some reason, though I can’t imagine how.
4-horse carriage is 600 lbs. with s capacity of 10,200 lbs.

And this is all assuming fixed numbers of animals that aren’t actually specified in the rules. How many horses can a carriage theoretically accomodate? If I want to save Christmas and hook eight reindeer up to my sled (let’s say that’s comparable carrying capacity to a mule?), will it actually bare the weight of the 16,500 lbs. of presents they can move, or will the tobagon collapse under all that? Can I hitch a single elephant to my wagon and load it up with 6,200 pounds?

Like, the majority of the time, this really doesn’t matter. At the end of the day, I’ll have NPC traders use what ever vehicles and beasts of burden feel right for them. But clearly there’s a point where the rules as written break down, and I wondered if anyone had suggestions for figuring out the theoretical maximum weight the sample vehicles could carry. I’ve gotten a few vague suggestions, but nothing concrete so far.

 

[Ganymede81]

Here's a way to do it...

Ok, let's assume that the cart, a vehicle designed to haul cargo, is a good baseline for deriving our capacity coefficient. A cart is designed to be pulled by one draft animal, so we can assume that it is also designed to handle the full carrying capacity of that animal. If we also assume that a vehicle's weight relates to its structural integrity (a heavier vehicle is more heavily reinforced), we can divide its remaining carrying capacity by its weight to get our coefficient: 2,500 / 200 = 12.5 pounds.

This means that every pound of vehicle weight can accommodate 12.5 pounds of cargo. Larding up a vehicle with weight beyond this ratio would risk structural failure (I'll leave those rules up to you).

(As an aside, I assume a PC would use a sled in lieu of a cart for arctic travel over snow. I mean, even if we ignore carrying capacity, why would most adventurers ever choose a sled over a cart anyways?)