D&D 5E Is acting on player banter a dick move?

[delericho]

Is it a dick move to have foes (of course make them roll stealth checks etc) spy on and stalk the party and when they hear the party talking out loud about how low on resources they are to step out laugh at the party tell them "We appreciate you telling us how hurt you are, it will make it so much easier to kill you" and then attack the party?

It's entirely reasonable to have the bad guys keep track of the PCs and choose the optimum time to strike. That's likely to be just after a major battle against someone else, precisely because they'll be low on hit points and spells.

It's a bad idea to have the bad guys gloat about it - best case, you're generating bad feeling amongst your players; worst case, the dice gods will hear you and invoke their own ironic punishment.

 

[Blue]

At my table it's general clear what's in-character and what isn't. Luckily most of my PCs have vocabulary and ways of speaking that make it obvious* when they are in character. That said, there's a fuzzy line, especially because the characters are present in the world and there's a lot of communication that isn't speech but the players have to convert to speech.

"I'm low on HPs" said out of character is a reminder to the players that their character is visibly wounded, bleeding, etc. Which is something that anyoen in the world can observe themselves if they are taking the time/focus to do so. "Hey, I'm hurt here, some healin' please" said in character is speech others can overhear. But both of those could be noticeable to someone spying on them.

In regards to tactics - coming up with something new I'd require them to talk in character, with the possibility of being overheard. On the other hand, standard moves that the character do together regularly is often just the characters seeing and understanding what's going on, so they player comment is just for us.

*"obvious" is still not always actually obvious. Last session the characters were debating a philosophical point and one of them was a lot more thoughtful, deep and loquacious then normal - they didn't pick up the excellent job the player was doing showing he was possessed.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[pming]

Hiya!

As others have stated...it's only a dick move if you suddenly spring it on them out of nowhere.

This is one of many aspects that fall firmly into the "experience gamer group". If you have new players, they don't know your DM'ing style, and you don't know their Playing style. If you are lucky enough to have a stable group, as the months and years tic by, it becomes "obvious" to everyone how their particular table-rules go.

My players, for example, know that I give them a fair bit of leeway if they make it quick. I liken it to the characters knowing that when Gronk the Barbarian looks at the Cleric, and lightly slaps his left forearm with his right hand (pantomiming 'slapping a bandaid on', more or less), that the Player probably said "I need some healing". Gronk didn't say a word. That said, they also know that if they just heard bad guys talking on the other side of the door in the dungeon they're in, and they suddenly take 5, 9, 12 minutes discussing tactics, magic item uses, ability use possibilities, etc...that their characters have moved well beyond the "pantomime or short phrase" communication and have been 'obviously' going into detail about everything; DM: "Suddenly, just as you're ready to kick in the door...it flies open! The bandits loose their crossbows at...er...sorry Gronk. You're the first going in, if I heard your plan right. Lets see, 1, 2, 3...7. Huh. Didn't think I had 7 d20's out here. What's your AC again Gronk?"

^_^

Paul L. Ming

 

[redrick]

In general, I would say, yes, using player banter against PCs is a dick move. For this not to be a dick move, you would have to justify it. (Specific beats general, after all.)

Certainly, I would not use knowing how many spell slots a character has left or exactly how many hp against them across multiple encounters. Knowing that a character is badly wounded? Sure. Should be clearly visible. Knowing that they've just used some spells because you heard the fireball go off? Sure. But planning a course of action based on the fact that the Fighter still has an Action Surge left but the Barbarian has used all their Rages? That's a low blow.

Now, as pming says, discussing detailed battle plans on the other side of a door from your opponents? That's foolish. But I would explain this the first time by saying, "Ok, so you guys are discussing your strategy for a few minutes in the corridor of the dungeon. Did anybody notice that the voices on the other side of the door have stopped?"

 

[Ed Laprade]

Yes, because player conversation does not always equal character conversation.

Unless you want it to....

And even warning ahead of time isn't enough if that's how they've always done it. That sort of convo can happen without the players even thinking about it, because they're so used to doing things that way.

So, to answer the question, yes it is a dick move. Unless the players haven't picked up any 'bad habits' yet, and are warned at the start of the game. AND reminded whenever they do forget.

 

[GameOgre]

If it's said at the game table it's said in the world unless for REAL out of character.

Like one player saying"Please get me a soda when you come back" if fine and out of character.

The same player saying"Geez are we going to kill this npc cause he is really getting on my nerves and I hate the little #$#$" is said in game as well just with in world words instead of game lingo.

Still that might not be overheard because it was whispered. I try to not be a jerk about it at the table while still making sure it's handled in the game but in some cases....well you should just watch what you say at the game table ...

 

[MichaelSomething]

For a laugh, you could have the PCs fight a bunch of bad guys that always announce their tactics and strategies. When the PCs note how dumb that is, respond by saying, "good thing you guys don't do that."

Sent from my [device_name] using EN World mobile app

 

[Guest 6801328]

Oh god I hate it when DMs say that anything you say that's game related is said in character. "Ha! The lizardmen hear your character say 'attack their caster' and so they form a defensive ring around him."

The last thing I want is to have to do is develop a system of code with the other players.

Player A: "49 alpha! 49 alpha!"

Player B: "Um...I forgot...does that mean attack the caster?"

Player C: "Ha! The lizardmen heard you say that..."

Yeah...no thanks.

I have no problem letting players 'freeze time' while they discuss what to do next. They are seasoned adventurers with combat and magic training, and with high Charisma. Players are not. (Especially the high Charisma part.)

 

[FrogReaver]

Oh god I hate it when DMs say that anything you say that's game related is said in character. "Ha! The lizardmen hear your character say 'attack their caster' and so they form a defensive ring around him."

The last thing I want is to have to do is develop a system of code with the other players.

Player A: "49 alpha! 49 alpha!"

Player B: "Um...I forgot...does that mean attack the caster?"

Player C: "Ha! The lizardmen heard you say that..."

Yeah...no thanks.

I have no problem letting players 'freeze time' while they discuss what to do next. They are seasoned adventurers with combat and magic training, and with high Charisma. Players are not. (Especially the high Charisma part.)

LOL. Smart players will say things to bait the DM into reacting to it. I'll say attack the caster so maybe all the enemies will bunch up around the caster and I can fireball them!!!