D&D 3E/3.5 Jonathan Tweet: Third Edition and Per-Day Spells

On the Third Edition design team, we were tasked with rationalizing the game system, but there were some big elements of the system that we didn’t question. We inherited a system in which spellcasters get better in three ways at a time as they level up; they get more spells per day, higher-level spells, and more damage with spells of a given level. In retrospect, that problem is easy to see, and we didn’t fix it. We also inherited a system that balanced powerful class features, notably spells, by making them usable once per day. The problems with that system are less obvious, and we didn’t fix this system, either. But the 3E system laid bare its own inner workings, and so soon enough designers saw that there were issues with this system, and over the years several of us designers have tried to address it one way or another.

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In classic dungeon crawling, the default best strategy is to take each room one at a time and regain your hit points and spells after each one. That’s no fun, so people usually don’t play that way. For 3E, we spelled out that the game was balanced for four average battles between heal-ups, but actual practice varied. Whatever per-day powers are balanced at one rate of fights per day are necessarily unbalanced at faster or slower rates. Classes with lots of per-day power are too strong when there are one or two fights per day and too weak when there are five or more. Individual Dungeon Masters might be able to schedule the action in such a way that they maintain the sort of balance they’re looking for. If that works, it represents the DM’s efforts and not anything we on the design team could accomplish through system design. Many Dungeon Masters might find the per-day rules convenient precisely because they allow the DM to modulate the threat level up and down. DMs rule on how many encounters the party has in a day and whether they can suspend their mission long enough to reset their spells and other per-day powers. A dynamic I’ve seen over and over again, however, is that players with spellcasting characters are adept at talking the DM into letting the party rest. When the spellcaster is out of spells, they need a night’s rest a lot more than the other characters in the party need to press on. When a mission goes south and the encounters burn up more per-day resources than the DM figured they would, the party often simply camps out for the night and sets out the next day with spells reset to full.

Limiting spells by day also means that a spellcaster’s power level is different when they’re in a preliminary skirmish compared to when they’re in a climactic showdown. When it’s a high-priority battle or when the player knows that there’s a long rest afterwards, the spellcaster can use their best spells without worrying about holding back. This effect is something of a game-wrecker when the party arranges to jump the big bad guy after prepping up to full. With a well-placed teleport, the party’s spellcasters can unload all their best “per-day” spells for the one battle that matters that day (an “alpha strike”). Classes with at-will powers can’t “unload” the way spellcasters can.

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The per-day system also changes up balance for NPCs. Generally, when a party attacks an NPC boss of some sort, that NPC is in a fight for their life, and they cut loose with every per-day power they can manage. Fighter NPCs aren’t particularly dangerous because they have no such resources to unleash. In my campaign, I found the psionicist NPC the most dangerous because they could use the point system to cast at full capacity every round. As player-characters, psionicists have all the balance problems of the wizard and then some.

Seeing the issues with per-day powers, the designers started experimenting with per-encounter powers in supplemental material. The psychic warrior, for example, had a “focus” that they could expend once in the battle in order to have a special effect. At that point, designers were still in simulation mode, and encounters that were “per-encounter” by fiat seemed too artificial. The psychic warrior had a believable, in-world reason for their “per-encounter” abilities. Tome of Battle: Book of the Nine Swords (2006) introduced special, limited-use powers for martial classes. By 4E, the designers fully embraced per-encounter powers.

Fourth edition established balance among the classes by giving all of them per-day and per-encounter powers. That’s one way to solve the balance issue. 4E is so well-balanced that it’s hard to make bad choices in character design. This approach had the unfortunate effect of making the classes all feel sort of the same.

With 13th Age, Rob Heinsoo and I took a different approach. We turned 3E’s four-fights guideline into a hard rule. You get your spells and hit points back not just by resting but only if you have engaged in a minimum amount of fighting. After your fourth fight (or after four fights’ worth of fighting), the party gets to reset to full. Alternatively, the party can admit defeat and get a heal-up without “earning” it, but admitting defeat entails a “campaign loss,” as determined by the GM. This system creates a lovely rhythm, with characters feeling flush and confident in the first fight, feeling hard pressed in the last fight, and then feeling good again when they heal up. I play a cleric in a 13th Age campaign, and the last fight before a heal-up is tough going. The last fight is so tough that we player all know that the decisions and rolls we made in the earlier fights all mattered in terms of what we have left for the last one.
 

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Jonathan Tweet

Jonathan Tweet

D&D 3E, Over the Edge, Everway, Ars Magica, Omega World, Grandmother Fish
It is interesting to see the comments on this; a very clear split into those who are very simulation-oriented ("13th Age is great!") and those who think of games as primarily simulation ("13th Age works well but I don't see how it makes sense").

I'm not sure this is reconcilable, honestly. If you require any form of in-game resources to cast spells (per-day casts, spell points, hit points) then any sane adventurer is going to alpha-strike the enemy and then rest up whenever possible. It's just a sensible thing to do from an in-game perspective. You can lessen the impact using various fixes, or you can run in game excuses why you cannot recover resources (which often are a bit silly: "the swaying of the boat prevents you from sleeping soundly", "magical forces prevent learning spells right now") but the core problems will always be there.

For those of us happy to put game rules ahead of simulation, it's much easier. We can just say "three hard fights before you recover resources" and be done. We can theme it for the benefit of the simulation-minded, but it's the same sort of thin veneer that seems silly ("the gods do not grant you recovery because you have not proved yourself in enough fights").

I'm in the middle of playing some Epic-level 4E at the moment, and our current arc is not letting us get full recoveries ever ... but some non-player characters can grant them if you follow their plot-lines, or you can dip into a magical pool and it'll work out. It feels very much a kludge to get around the problem of trying to simulate in a way that makes the game fun -- we are playing I think about 4 modules in a single day, so no full recoveries, but instead the game inserts them as "GM events" every ... um ... three hard encounters or so?

Basically it's almost exactly using the 13th Age model, but adding on a simulationist facade. Which is both a bit silly and bit frustrating.
 

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It is interesting to see the comments on this; a very clear split into those who are very simulation-oriented ("13th Age is great!") and those who think of games as primarily simulation ("13th Age works well but I don't see how it makes sense").

I'm not sure this is reconcilable, honestly. If you require any form of in-game resources to cast spells (per-day casts, spell points, hit points) then any sane adventurer is going to alpha-strike the enemy and then rest up whenever possible. It's just a sensible thing to do from an in-game perspective. You can lessen the impact using various fixes, or you can run in game excuses why you cannot recover resources (which often are a bit silly: "the swaying of the boat prevents you from sleeping soundly", "magical forces prevent learning spells right now") but the core problems will always be there.

For those of us happy to put game rules ahead of simulation, it's much easier. We can just say "three hard fights before you recover resources" and be done. We can theme it for the benefit of the simulation-minded, but it's the same sort of thin veneer that seems silly ("the gods do not grant you recovery because you have not proved yourself in enough fights").

I'm in the middle of playing some Epic-level 4E at the moment, and our current arc is not letting us get full recoveries ever ... but some non-player characters can grant them if you follow their plot-lines, or you can dip into a magical pool and it'll work out. It feels very much a kludge to get around the problem of trying to simulate in a way that makes the game fun -- we are playing I think about 4 modules in a single day, so no full recoveries, but instead the game inserts them as "GM events" every ... um ... three hard encounters or so?

Basically it's almost exactly using the 13th Age model, but adding on a simulationist facade. Which is both a bit silly and bit frustrating.
Coming from the simulationist perspective, I don't think it's that bad, at least in 5E where I currently play. First off, I try to stay away from the sillier limitations you mentioned for preventing excessive resting. My reasons tend to be something like "if you try to rest here, there's a good chance you'll be ambushed" or "You can rest, but the bandits already have a lead and you might not be able to catch up to them before they reach the slave market if you do". Something rooted in the fiction of the world, but also often a situation where they really can rest if they want to, it will just have ramifications in the world if they choose to do so.

Another thing I do is I throw fewer, harder fights at them in most games, cutting down the number of fights I expect them to have between rests to about 2 to 4 on average. Sometimes, I would say quite often, the number of fights will be 1.

And that's another thing I do to keep on the simulationist side of pacing encounters: I'm fine if they just nova all at once in a fight. Honestly, it does make encounters easier, sometimes it trivializes encounters that would otherwise have been challenging. But my players tend to view that as empowering, and therefore fun, which means it doesn't really bother me. And if they do completely nova, they accept that if there is another encounter (or multiple) that come before they find a way to safely rest, then those encounters will be more difficult and taxing. That risk/reward tradeoff is itself a source of tension, and also leads to what I consider interesting and fun gameplay where the dragon may be slain and the heroes triumphant, but now the fight to prevent his cave giant followers from stealing his horde while your party is trying to rest is just as challenging as the original dragon fight was.

So I don't think it ends up being identical to the 13th age model, as there are different emergent outcomes and tradeoffs that the PCs are involved in. They have a layer of resource management to engage with that isn't there in 13th age, and you get game moments that wouldn't have happened or at least would have been baked in and broadcast way ahead of time in 13th age, but which emerged from random chance and player decisions in this method. It's not "superior", because the 13th age method will lead to more even gameplay, a more predictable rhythm of encounters, and have less chance of trivializing an encounter that you meant to be climactic or killing characters/parties as a result of poor planning or plain poor luck.

So it really is a matter of taste, but I reject the idea that simulationism is either "the 13th Age model, but adding on a simulationist facade" or iredeemably broken.
 

It is interesting to see the comments on this; a very clear split into those who are very simulation-oriented ("13th Age is great!") and those who think of games as primarily simulation ("13th Age works well but I don't see how it makes sense").
What I got from the article was, "Here's some problems that arise from trying to make logical sense of the world, and our eventual solution for those problems was to stop trying to make logical sense of the world."

That's pretty disappointing.
 

One thing I like about 13th age's casters was that they get to decide how "intense" they want to be. For example, a 5th level sorcerer would have 3 3rd-level spells and 4 5th-level spells (spell levels work a little different). Each spell is then either Daily, Recharge X (roll d20 after each battle, recharge on X or higher), Once per Battle, or At Will. You're strongly recommended to take at least one at-will spell, but other than that you can choose what mix you want. Want big nova potential? Take all dailies. Want staying power? Take once/battle spells. Most would go with a mix, but it's up to you.

Another thing about 13th age's limited resources is the Escalation Die. At the end of the first round, place a big d6 on the table set to "1", and each round after that increment it by 1. PCs (usually not monsters, but some do) get to add this to their attack rolls. This creates a number of effects, but one is that it encourages you to lead with weaker abilities like at wills or maybe once/battle spells, and save the big guns for later when they have a greater chance of hitting.
 

What I got from the article was, "Here's some problems that arise from trying to make logical sense of the world, and our eventual solution for those problems was to stop trying to make logical sense of the world."

That's pretty disappointing.

Harsh, but an insightful take.

The question I have is, "Why don't armies always fight when they are well rested, fully equipped, and at full strength?"

After all, we don't need magic to make this an issue. Humans take a while to recover from injuries. Supplies take time to bring up to the front. Humans fight better when they aren't exhausted, physically or emotionally.

So why doesn't an army just take a long break after every battle in order to reach the peak of its potential fitness?

I think the answers to that question satisfy most people on the "simulationist" side of this debate, even in cases where you have daily resources. I think it only becomes a problem to solve when you want to free yourself from needing to pace your story in such a way that those "logistic" or "operational" concerns occur within the space of a day.

But I agree with you that it is ironic, that an impulse that seems to have begun out of a desire to tell a wider range of stories without artificial constraint, arrives at a solution that involves constraining the story to a single paradigm.
 

Another thing about 13th age's limited resources is the Escalation Die.
It's been a while since I played 13th Age, and I'd forgotten about the escalation die. But it was hands down my favorite thing from the system, a huge boon for game flow and very exciting at the table. I stole it for a while for my 4E game back in the day, then apparently forgot about it.

I wonder if it would be a good houserule for 5E? Maybe just used in boss fights, maybe in all fights? I might try that out and see how it feels!
 

It's been a while since I played 13th Age, and I'd forgotten about the escalation die. But it was hands down my favorite thing from the system, a huge boon for game flow and very exciting at the table. I stole it for a while for my 4E game back in the day, then apparently forgot about it.

I wonder if it would be a good houserule for 5E? Maybe just used in boss fights, maybe in all fights? I might try that out and see how it feels!
If you use it in 5e or any other D20 game then you need to boost the enemies' AC and other defenses by 1 (or say that the players need to beat the AC to hit rather than match it). Otherwise, it should work fine.
 

There's more to the issue of 3e (and 4e and 5e, for that matter) casting unbalance that the article maybe intentionally skips over: in 3e successfully casting a spell was made much easier than in previous editions.

Here's how:

Most spells (and nearly all combat spells) resolved on the same initiative as they were cast, thus no casting time a la 1e-2e and thus much less opportunity to interrupt the casting. As a side effect this also meant spells on average resolved earlier in the round sequence.

The concept of 'combat casting' was brought in (an 'option' taken IME by every single caster ever played) making spells even harder to interrupt. In 1e-2e ANY interruption of any kind - even just a non-damaging jostle - would make you lose the spell.

Much or all of the real risk was nerfed or removed from some key game-altering spells. No more system-shock roll required when polymorphing someone not yourself, leading to rampant polymorph headaches. No more risk of instant death by teleporting into solid rock below your target point, thus causing 'alpha strike' to become the obvious go-to tactic for any party that could do it. Etc.

Magic in 1e-2e was rather high-risk high-reward. Take away the risk and no wonder casters got out of hand in 3e.
 

The Vancian system works just fine if the DM has a spine. No-rest areas because of wandering monsters or regular security patrols by the opposition work wonders. A fixed minimum number of encounters is blatantly artificial. There's no reason that a party couldn't have three combat encounters and then no combat for several days. It's preposterous to hold that recharging during a few days of travel means you "lose" a campaign.
 

There's more to the issue of 3e (and 4e and 5e, for that matter) casting unbalance that the article maybe intentionally skips over: in 3e successfully casting a spell was made much easier than in previous editions.

I think this has been a rather steady trend.

There were all sorts of weird little limitations on spells in 1e AD&D that served to balance otherwise unbalanced spells. My vote for the most relevant but obscure one, was that in 1e AD&D whenever the spell Haste was cast on you, that it aged you 2 years - a drawback that meant you saw it cast only a few times a campaign in groups that became aware of the drawback.

In 3e D&D, Haste largely retained the 1e AD&D mechanical implementation (translated to 3e terms), but it lacked any drawback that would prevent you from casting it all the time. Not only that, but the restriction that spells could not be cast at a hastened rate went away. Not unsurprisingly, the new Haste was quickly identified as one of the most problematic spells in the game in as much as that it was pretty much every spell-casters opening gambit if they had access to it.
 

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