D&D General A look at WotC and Paizo Product Lines (and their different approaches)

[Mercurius]

Given the nature of Corporate sales accounting, I suspect that they are aiming to have a new book every Quarter. Almost got Q1 and Q2 this year.

Yes, and if they do add a 5th or 6th book, we'd probably see a second November title, and maybe a second summer title.

 

[Parmandur]

Yes, and if they do add a 5th or 6th book, we'd probably see a second November title, and maybe a second summer title.

If they wanted to move past one big product a Quarter, I'd say it would be for a box set or similar non-hardcover book.

 

[Khelon Testudo]

I doubt D&D would be as popular, if, after watching Critical Role, people went and bought the core books and found them impenetrable. 4e would have had that issue, IMHO. 2e? Maybe. The fact that 5e is relatively easy to get into is a factor in its popularity.

 

[DEFCON 1]

...if, after watching Critical Role, people went and bought the core books and found them impenetrable. 4e would have had that issue...

Disagree. We live in an age where millions of people have played variations of the roleplaying game in other forms, all of them with various levels of rules-- computer video games, board games etc. 4E's ruleset is by no means impenetrable, especially by people who are coming in new to the hobby. There's nothing in the system that people haven't experienced in some format and fashion in other games. If you can go from knowing nothing of D&D and making the jump to learning 5E... you can do the same from knowing nothing and making the jump straight to 4E.

Personally, I think It's the people who spent years using the other D&D rulesets of the past who looked at 4E and found the new formatting odd and not what they were used to. They were the ones who were so locked in to older styles of D&D that made 4E seems so alien and unable to be comprehended.

(And I say "unable to be comprehended" facitiously... as of course they could understand the rules if they really felt like they wanted to. But instead, since the formatting and rules changes were a departure from what they were already happy with, they just chose not to bother.)

 

[Steel_Wind]

Paizo's insane publishing schedule is possible because:

1 - They have a vastly larger number of employees than WotC's D&D division, though they pay most of them less . Cranking out that much material takes real and direct supervised labor (yes Paizo uses lots of freelancers, too); and,
2- Above all, direct sales via subscription.

Note that Paizo's product schedule, as large is it is now, was far larger in the 2013-2017 era when PF1 was the 500lb gorilla.

Yes, there are thousands of people who buy all of Paizo's product releases every month. Pawns excepted, I would be one of them. Numbers have not been officially released, but my guess (and that all it is - a guess) is that PF subscriber base is somewhere in the order of 8,000-20,000 regular subscription customers; a number which has risen and fallen over time. Whatever the case, that sort of predictable, bankable direct sales (with immediate cashflow) is core to Paizo's business model. Without it? That production schedule and employee base is not sustainable. With it? It mostly is. Mostly. Essentially, Paizo prints on terms in China, and on ship, their direct sales pay for the cost of the product - and then some. How much "and then some" is the devil in the details.

Still , core rulebooks, which can be printed in the hundreds of thousands of copies over the course of a game's life is where the real money is in RPG publishing, so WotC focuses on those sales via retailers. Those same FLGS retailers are the ones who generate the real money selling hobby games: which is to say, selling Magic:TG for WotC. [All RPGs taken together are modest compared to MAGIC:TG. It also explains why WotC has been reticent to sell directly. WotC depends on those retailer relationships.]

The direct sales model allowed Paizo to dominate the RPG business from 2010-2016. But when 5e started to gain some real legs in the marketplace, by early 2017, Paizo's retail sales via FLGS had dropped significantly.

Players like direct sales and the free PDFs a subscription provides. FLGS store owners? Not so much.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

A clarification/possible nitpick for the OP because I do not have the book and have no interested in reading through it at a store....

Would Acquisitions Inc better be described as a setting and less as a rulebook? I'm curious because I am interested in generally useful materials but have no use at all for setting specific details like NPC names, locations, etc... and assumed AI mostly contained that kind of information.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

You can abstractly question the contribution of the product release strategy, but I myself have bought many, many times more books than I did in earlier editions. Before 5E, I bout the 3.0 PHB and the 4E PHB. I've bought every 5 hardcover, except Acquisitions Incorporated. That's like ten times as many books, and the slow release schedule and mixed products have been a major factor there.

I am the anti-you when it comes to D&D purchases.

In the 3e era I purchased almost every official rulebook published, along with a couple of the FR books as well. I run a homebrew campaign (always have) and have no desire to pick up a book that I am not going to be able to use more than a 1/4 of the content of. I bought a LOT of 3e books.

In the 4e era I did the same, getting all the rulebooks and skipping the campaign settings. I stopped playing 4e when Essentials rolled out but that was because of the system, not the content.

In the 5e era I have only purchased the 6 setting and adventure neutral books and have no interest in purchasing anything else. With the release rate of 1 book that fits this bill every other year....I have purchased less 5e product than I purchased 2e product (when I was in High School and bummed money off my parents once in a blue moon to add a book to my collection)

 

[Parmandur]

I am the anti-you when it comes to D&D purchases.

In the 3e era I purchased almost every official rulebook published, along with a couple of the FR books as well. I run a homebrew campaign (always have) and have no desire to pick up a book that I am not going to be able to use more than a 1/4 of the content of. I bought a LOT of 3e books.

In the 4e era I did the same, getting all the rulebooks and skipping the campaign settings. I stopped playing 4e when Essentials rolled out but that was because of the system, not the content.

In the 5e era I have only purchased the 6 setting and adventure neutral books and have no interest in purchasing anything else. With the release rate of 1 book that fits this bill every other year....I have purchased less 5e product than I purchased 2e product (when I was in High School and bummed money off my parents once in a blue moon to add a book to my collection)

You are missing out.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

You are missing out.

I have a big old pile of boardgames that money went to instead to enjoy.

 

[Mercurius]

Disagree. We live in an age where millions of people have played variations of the roleplaying game in other forms, all of them with various levels of rules-- computer video games, board games etc. 4E's ruleset is by no means impenetrable, especially by people who are coming in new to the hobby. There's nothing in the system that people haven't experienced in some format and fashion in other games. If you can go from knowing nothing of D&D and making the jump to learning 5E... you can do the same from knowing nothing and making the jump straight to 4E.

Personally, I think It's the people who spent years using the other D&D rulesets of the past who looked at 4E and found the new formatting odd and not what they were used to. They were the ones who were so locked in to older styles of D&D that made 4E seems so alien and unable to be comprehended.

(And I say "unable to be comprehended" facitiously... as of course they could understand the rules if they really felt like they wanted to. But instead, since the formatting and rules changes were a departure from what they were already happy with, they just chose not to bother.)

You're mostly talking about experienced gamers. But the important question is, is 5E easier to learn from scratch, both for those "mentoring" with an existing group, and a bunch of kids inspired by Stranger Things who buy the Essentials Kit at Target?

I think,the answer is clear. 5E is a simpler rules system. It also has improvisation and hand-waving built into it in a way that makes it easier to "wing it until you get it."

But yes, I agree that it was mostly experienced D&D players who found 4E off-putting. The difference in mechanics and tone was rather jarring for traditional-minded D&D players.