D&D 5E What Level 20 Class Would Win?

[FrogReaver]

In our tests we used 10d4 x 10 feet starting range if both combattants were ranged. If one (or both) of them was melee, we would use 2d4 x10 feet. Characters were on a plain. No hills, sunny day.

Seems kind of close. In any event, you are in distant counterspell range. Given distant and subtle I'm not sure how the wizard is getting any spell off while the sorcerer is getting spells off.

In close quarters testing (a 60 x60 room), all casters were failing save the f***ing diviner. The use of contingency in close quarters was saving the bas***d's asses more often than not. Those three dices are real killers.

I do expect the diviner to beat pretty much everything else.

How exactly were you using contingency?

 

[FrogReaver]

Looking at the Druid, am I missing anything other than basically being invulnerable due to infinite shape changes?

 

[Helldritch]

Seems kind of close. In any event, you are in distant counterspell range. Given distant and subtle I'm not sure how the wizard is getting any spell off while the sorcerer is getting spells off.



I do expect the diviner to beat pretty much everything else.

How exactly were you using contingency?

Depending on the foe. Against casters, it was pretty much spells that would remove him from LOS or prevent damage. Simulacrums would be used as distraction, decoys and counterspellers. No caster would be able to cast anything. Of course, the simulacrums would not regain expended spell slots but their jobs was to shut down casters. We went with logic and assumed that sorcerers would not use simulacrums as this is usually a poor choice for a sorcerer.

In hind sight, we might have been better off giving it to the sorcerer too. But so far, no sorcerer ever took it in our games. (Two groups of 6 players). Nor have I heard about a sorcerer taking this spell in other gaming groups that I am aware of in my area. Maybe it is something that most people in my area underestimate...

As I should stress, we were not perfect and our tests were made as 5ed had been out for about a week or so. Some mistakes about rules and such might (must?) have been made.

Edit: And the damened simulacrums had two diviner's dice to boot. All their counter spells would pass the opposing cheks. You fail, we saw it!!!

 

[FrogReaver]

Depending on the foe. Against casters, it was pretty much spells that would remove him from LOS or prevent damage. Simulacrums would be used as distraction, decoys and counterspellers. No caster would be able to cast anything. Of course, the simulacrums would not regain expended spell slots but their jobs was to shut down casters. We went with logic and assumed that sorcerers would not use simulacrums as this is usually a poor choice for a sorcerer.

In hind sight, we might have been better off giving it to the sorcerer too. But so far, no sorcerer ever took it in our games. (Two groups of 6 players). Nor have I heard about a sorcerer taking this spell in other gaming groups that I am aware of in my area. Maybe it is something that most people in my area underestimate...

As I should stress, we were not perfect and our tests were made as 5ed had been out for about a week or so. Some mistakes about rules and such might (must?) have been made.

yea... what is arguably the 2nd best spell in a 1v1 caster battle and you had the sorcerer not take it...

 

[Minigiant]

Depends if there is something to hide behind and you "enter" the fight unseen.

 

[Helldritch]

yea... what is arguably the 2nd best spell in a 1v1 caster battle and you had the sorcerer not take it...

Yep. But we went for what would be chosen logically. Sorcerers were almost (dare I say never) taking this spell in my area. So we went with what a sorcerer would most likely choose for his limited known seventh level spells. As I said, simulacrum is not that powerful in a normal adventuring day. They get destroyed pretty fast and the cost of casting it is prohibitive in my campaign (4500 gp is a fortune in my campaigns). In addition, most if not all sorcerers are allergic to long rituals. For some reasons, people in my area play sorcerers very aggressively and rituals, save for detect magic and identify, are never taken. This explains why sorcerers would not take simulacrum in my area.

Again I must stress that the combattants were not made solely for one on one fight. We were also pitting them against monster groups of various size and powers. We were not only testing duel potentials but solo scenarii too. So the chosen spells would have to be used in all scenarii, even duels. What is good for duelling, is bad for solo scenarii. So if you wanted your build to perform in all aspects of the tests, you had to be extra carefull.

I hope it clarifies how we tested the various characters.

 

[Hohige]

Ishhhh the mage can detonate the meteors at leisure. One can be a direct hit, the other ones will only be 30d6 for a total of 10d4 + 40d6 and a probably failed save if the diviner had the initiative (as in you fail, I saw it). The sorcerer is not proficient in dex save and will most likely miss the save. This bring you more in the lines of 95 damage. Assuming no feat and no magic the sorcerer is, at best, at 182hp. He is now in the range of a PW kill. With a nice contingeny, the mage should be able to avoid the sorcerer first magical onslaught and finish the job on round two. Remember the diviner can say you miss your save (ok, it depends on the dice, but since you insist on your perfect case, so am I).
Edit: Ho and do not forget simulacrums. I did not even accounted these...

No feat no magical item no money

Let's show how to play a Meteor Swarm Battle.

1) The Dragon sorc can fly and avoid any enemy meteor swarm.

2) As action use Aasimar's Radiant Consumption for extra (No save) 30 radiant damage on your spell.

3) Cast a Quickened Empowered Elemental Affiinity Radiant Consumption Meteor Swarm as bonus action.
It's 154 with empowered + 5 elemental afinity + 30 Radiant Consumption for Sweet 189 damage.
The Simulacrum just cast Subtle Power Word Stun / Sleep (No counterspell) (If you are close enough)
Or just use its action for Radiant Soul and cast quickened empowered radiant soul Insect Plague at 320 range as bonus action if you are on long range.
Upcasted to level 8 is 8d10 Empowered +30.

Well It's over.

 

[DND_Reborn]

No feat no magical item no money

Let's show how to play a Meteor Swarm Battle.

1) The Dragon sorc can fly and avoid any enemy meteor swarm.

2) As action use Aasimar's Radiant Consumption for extra (No save) 30 radiant damage on your spell.

3) Cast a Quickened Empowered Elemental Affiinity Radiant Consumption Meteor Swarm as bonus action.
It's 154 with empowered + 5 elemental afinity + 30 Radiant Consumption for Sweet 189 damage.
The Simulacrum just cast Subtle Power Word Stun / Sleep (No counterspell) (If you are close enough)
Or just use its action for Radiant Soul and cast quickened empowered radiant soul Insect Plague at 320 range as bonus action if you are on long range.
Upcasted to level 8 is 8d10 Empowered +30.

Well It's over.

You keep changing your bloodline. First Shadow, now Draconic. So, which is it?

You can't tailor your build according to the threat since you don't know what you'll be facing. Will you face Foresight? Meteor Swarm? Invulnerability? Time Stop? Wish?

After all, a Wizard is now invulnerable to every little bit of damage you just did. With Anitmagic Field and nothing you do touches him.

I'd say it is FAR from over.

 

[R_J_K75]

Bard, they'll just bore every other class to death.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Bard, they'll just bore every other class to death.

OMG! You are right! I have to go change my vote...