How to handle adventuring loot outside of a strong economy?

[Lackofname]

I'm hitting a snag with an upcoming campaign.

The setup is very similar to the pre-Colonial period of the USA. The PCs are part of the first settlers on a new continent full of natives on a similar technological level to the Native Americans.

Part of the result though is that it's probably a barter system instead of a strong currency; "Will give sheep for wood" is nothing that can be translated to GP.

This presents a problem giving out treasure. Characters expect magical items and I want to give magical items. If they get an item they don't want, they should be able to sell it for something--and use that to get something they want. But even before the magical items, there's still the matter of finding something that is worth x gold, and having nothing to do with that gold.

Sure, I know about inherent bonuses, providing alternative rewards, story-awards ("You can have my daughter's hand in marriage" "How do we split that among the party?"), those are already baked in.

What do I do beyond that?

And going back to the issue of the natives not having currency, say the PCs want an item created, or something as simple as healing potions. What do the locals charge?

 

[pming]

Hiya!

Do the PC's "owe" anyone for this opportunity? Like, are they part of "the government", or maybe a "trading company" or are they doing this under the employ of some rich mogul from back home in France/Germany/England/Norway/Sweden/etc?

If they ARE "indebted/working for" someone or an organization, then just have any "GP Value" of stuff they get/recover/etc, then equate some GP value into "Status Points" or "Contribution Merit". This total is then kept by the PC's and they can then 'use' these points to obtain stuff; information, weapons, medical help, horses, helpers, etc.

That way, if they find a magic item they don't want...they "hand it over to the Company" and it gets crated up and sent back to the Homeland. PC gets X amount of StatusPoints, then, if the PC needs to travel down the coast and needs a horse...he just head's over to an outfitter and "shows his mark"; outfitter then basically treats it as an IOU from the Company; PC get's a horse and tack.

This removes the need for specific GP value trading...and it also reinforces the idea of the PC's still having strong ties and responsibilities to the Big Players in the New World (governments, uber rich nobility, churches, trading companies, etc).

Maybe that will work? Once you establish that the Native's can also make use of this...so the PC can give a Chief a "letter of mark/purchase/IOU" that the Chief can then trade with other Europeans for stuff they want...all without the Native Americans actually having to travel directly into, say, 'Boston', or maybe use it as a bribe to an army captain who has designs on a fertile valley for setting up a fort or something...

^_^

Paul L. Ming

 

[tetrasodium]

I'm hitting a snag with an upcoming campaign.

The setup is very similar to the pre-Colonial period of the USA. The PCs are part of the first settlers on a new continent full of natives on a similar technological level to the Native Americans.

Part of the result though is that it's probably a barter system instead of a strong currency; "Will give sheep for wood" is nothing that can be translated to GP.

This presents a problem giving out treasure. Characters expect magical items and I want to give magical items. If they get an item they don't want, they should be able to sell it for something--and use that to get something they want. But even before the magical items, there's still the matter of finding something that is worth x gold, and having nothing to do with that gold.

Sure, I know about inherent bonuses, providing alternative rewards, story-awards ("You can have my daughter's hand in marriage" "How do we split that among the party?"), those are already baked in.

What do I do beyond that?

And going back to the issue of the natives not having currency, say the PCs want an item created, or something as simple as healing potions. What do the locals charge?

That period was very much company towns that focused on logging/gathering furs/maybe some mining. Even though the town didn't mint currency they still issued company scrip that could be used to purchase goods in the company store & approved businesses (ie a bar & brothel). You could convert scrip to currency, but just like going to a currency exchange you had a fee & those fees could make the prospect of doing so a huge loss. All of that made sure that the labor couldn't just travel to another company town or book passage on a ship elsewhere. Selling resources to the company could very likely depend on your relationship with them when it came time to tally things up.

I would start by making new price lists for weapons/armor/adventuring gear, any common magic items, & your own trade goods but twist things in two important ways that will keep your players off balance. Keep a list yourself where each widget has a standard value but a range that varies like 20-50% up/down. List the prices in scrip & be sure to include the unpleasant cost of converting scrip to gp/sp/cp (again with a range).Give your players the new price lists but leave out the currency conversion lines & only give them the range rather than the actual price... If the players are buying/selling stuff pick a random value in or around the range based on how well the company likes them.

 

[KahlessNestor]

The list of trade goods might be a place to start.

Alternatively, figure out what the natives value, what do they have and not have. What are they already using for trade. This is how you get the Dutch buying Manhattan island for a bunch of trinkets that are valueless to the colonials, but valuable to the natives.

The colonials are there for something, too, like furs or precious metals, specialty wood, etc.

The replies above about colonial benefactors (Patrons) are good too.

 

[Lackofname]

Hiya!

Do the PC's "owe" anyone for this opportunity? Like, are they part of "the government", or maybe a "trading company" or are they doing this under the employ of some rich mogul from back home in France/Germany/England/Norway/Sweden/etc?

If they ARE "indebted/working for" someone or an organization, then just have any "GP Value" of stuff they get/recover/etc, then equate some GP value into "Status Points" or "Contribution Merit". This total is then kept by the PC's and they can then 'use' these points to obtain stuff; information, weapons, medical help, horses, helpers, etc.

That way, if they find a magic item they don't want...they "hand it over to the Company" and it gets crated up and sent back to the Homeland. PC gets X amount of StatusPoints, then, if the PC needs to travel down the coast and needs a horse...he just head's over to an outfitter and "shows his mark"; outfitter then basically treats it as an IOU from the Company; PC get's a horse and tack.

Not really? I mean, "horse and tack" is a couple gold pieces compared to thousands for magical items; the most expensive thing I think is something like plate armor, which is about 50gp? Gold exists to buy magical items. Problem is "back home" is a couple months round trip, so by the time they sell that +1 sword for a +1 axe and it shows up on a ship, the +1 now needs to be a +2.

And honestly the PCs already Will be able to get helpers/medical assistance/etc. They are showing up on shore being fairly recognized by the colony leaders, rather than just Joe Settler.

Let me be blunt: I don't care about the actual cost of items. Tracking the minutia of ammo and supplies and rations and individual coinage and going shopping bores me, so I'd rather eat a cat than create a whole new bean-counting system just to handwave whatever they do with the jade idol they find in the sunken temple. Honestly, I'd be happy with "you have everything you need in your inventory at any given time because you're professionals who plan with foresight". And frankly I find buying and selling magical items to be galling.

But all the above violates the expectations of players, especially ones showing up to a table for the first time (which this is). It messes with the status quo. It takes the fun out of discovering a bag of gold when it's no different from a bag of dirt. Some players legitimately enjoy the resource-management mini-game. And in a game where you can't buy and sell magical items, it means every item needs to be painstakingly chosen ahead of time to fit every PC, which is equally annoying when one player will only use Western Extra-Thick Deluxe Spiked Chain because finding an Eastern Thin Premium Spiked Chain will invalidate half his character sheet, so now forgotten ruins need to be peppered with exact upgrades of the PCs' chosen gear.

And it hurts the world, because while I am not a simulationist, there does need to be the veneer of believing it's real and that goods aren't sold with a wave and a smile.

What I'm ultimately saying is, my setting's constraints is butting up against by-the-book D&D economy, but deviating from the book creates a lot of unpleasant work.

 

[Lackofname]

The list of trade goods might be a place to start.

Alternatively, figure out what the natives value, what do they have and not have. What are they already using for trade. This is how you get the Dutch buying Manhattan island for a bunch of trinkets that are valueless to the colonials, but valuable to the natives.

The problem is when you try to convert beads to gold is what I'm sayin'.

I also don't want to sit and do the math of "how many furs is a +1 sword worth?"

 

[Jd Smith1]

I do not give unwanted magical items. By coincidence, every item or weapon the PCs find in my campaign is useful.

This eliminates the entire business of buying and selling magical items.

 

[Lackofname]

I do not give unwanted magical items. By coincidence, every item or weapon the PCs find in my campaign is useful.

This eliminates the entire business of buying and selling magical items.

What happens to the old gear? Do they just toss the ol' +1 axe in a trunk now that they have the new +2 axe?

 

[Umbran]

I'm hitting a snag with an upcoming campaign.

The setup is very similar to the pre-Colonial period of the USA. The PCs are part of the first settlers on a new continent full of natives on a similar technological level to the Native Americans.

Okay, so... here's some questions for you.
1) Why are the PCs there? Why is the settlement there?
2) What's the relationship with the local culture like?
3) Where are they getting treasures?

A standard situation would be that the natives are the descendants of some previous higher culture that made all the treasures. Those treasures may well then mean something to the natives as part of their cultural or religious heritage.

You can then imagine the following barter system:
1) PCs go out to ruins and come back with treasures.
2) PCs trade treasures with natives for wood/wool/grain.
3) PCs turn wood/wool/grain/cool local products with new settlement, which probably needs the supplies badly.
4) Settlement now owes PCs some number of GP value of other stuff. Local smiths and alchemists and wizards can make them, the settlement can send home for them, or whatever.

You don't need to work out how many furs is a +1 sword. You can still work with GP as your accounting. "You find a bunch of treasures. The natives give you X GP worth of furs for them."

Also, the locals are probably going to be willing to work for favors - "You want healing potions? Sure, our healer's really good at making them! How about you go chase that otyugh out of our midden-trench outside the village, and we'll get you what you need..."

 

[Jd Smith1]

What happens to the old gear? Do they just toss the ol' +1 axe in a trunk now that they have the new +2 axe?

Magical weapons are creations of great power that draw from their user and use; when unused, they decline into a dormant state. Thus when you find it, it is just +1. After X number of successful hits, and a couple deeds or kills based on its backstory, it becomes +2, or awakens another ability.

And so forth. A PC will only need one enchanted weapon for the duration of the campaign.

I never liked the 'discard a weapon for another' aspect of D&D. Sting was passed down from family member to family member, after all.

The key is to create a history of the weapon that requires a user to do X, Y, and Z to awaken aspects. I like to use every possible opportunity to create scenarios.