D&D General why do we have halflings and gnomes?

[tetrasodium]

Interesting points.

Haven't done the whole "what would it take" analysis, but I suspect you can get spell analogues to handle most of the supply chain. If the to of my head "move earth" "tenser's floating disc" "speak with animals" various methods for fast travel.

Not sure how much spellcasting it'd take to break all the assumptions, but a lot of the big issues get solved handily by low level spells.

You can & we know it because that's one of the key differences between Eberron & FR. Coincidentally eberron halflings & gnomes are also more developed than those of FR's hobbits bu tnot legally in court

 

[Minigiant]

Tall... hobbits...?

Halflings are a bit taller than hobbits

 

[Oofta]

Interesting points.

Haven't done the whole "what would it take" analysis, but I suspect you can get spell analogues to handle most of the supply chain. If the to of my head "move earth" "tenser's floating disc" "speak with animals" various methods for fast travel.

Not sure how much spellcasting it'd take to break all the assumptions, but a lot of the big issues get solved handily by low level spells.

Depends on the level of magic in your campaign. If you have a world like Eberron, certainly it would require less. But a lot of things simply couldn't be replicated easily with the magic spells that are in the book. There's no "thresh wheat and barley" cantrip, mold earth (move earth is a 6th level spell) might be handy but do you have fine enough control to dig up root vegetables? A wagon will hold significantly more than a floating disc, and the wagon won't go away after an hour, assuming you have someone trained in magic.

I do assume that magic assists in my campaign - and a lot of magic in my world isn't the flashy stuff that adventurers do - but unless you have golems running around doing the manual labor I'm not sure how much of a difference it would make.

 

[Voadam]

Halflings are a bit taller than hobbits

I think you might be thinking of 4e when they were about four feet tall. The 5e PH says "Halflings average about 3 feet tall"

 

[Gammadoodler]

Depends on the level of magic in your campaign. If you have a world like Eberron, certainly it would require less. But a lot of things simply couldn't be replicated easily with the magic spells that are in the book. There's no "thresh wheat and barley" cantrip, mold earth (move earth is a 6th level spell) might be handy but do you have fine enough control to dig up root vegetables? A wagon will hold significantly more than a floating disc, and the wagon won't go away after an hour, assuming you have someone trained in magic.

I do assume that magic assists in my campaign - and a lot of magic in my world isn't the flashy stuff that adventurers do - but unless you have golems running around doing the manual labor I'm not sure how much of a difference it would make.

The bigger stuff honestly is stuff like magical healing, cure disease, etc. Having any of that in reasonable quantity dramatically changes potential demographic composition.

You make fair points though. It is something of a dial that can be turned up or down. I do think it's an area that doesn't withstand a great deal of scrutiny though.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Yeah, but no. As DM/adventurers, you are by design encountering those sorts of things at a far, far, FAR higher rate than the rest of the world. It skews the perception and makes it seem like these things happen a lot.

Basically, it's the players' fault that these things happen, because they need to be given adventure.

Except for the part that the lore tells us that Orcs/Goblins/Ogres/Ettins/Trolls/Hill Giants ect don't farm and constantly attack and raid the civilized people.

And that ignores all of the bestial monsters that attack people like Wyverns, Bullettes, Ankhegs, Griffons, Harpies, Perytons, Ettercaps, Displacer Beasts, Luecrotta, Manticore, Owlbears, Girallons, ect

And then you have all of the evil societies, evil dragons, demon and Devil attacks.

Even if each thing is only a 1% chance of happening per year, you start getting into 50/50 odds when you consider how much stuff can go wrong.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Depends on the level of magic in your campaign. If you have a world like Eberron, certainly it would require less. But a lot of things simply couldn't be replicated easily with the magic spells that are in the book. There's no "thresh wheat and barley" cantrip, mold earth (move earth is a 6th level spell) might be handy but do you have fine enough control to dig up root vegetables? A wagon will hold significantly more than a floating disc, and the wagon won't go away after an hour, assuming you have someone trained in magic.

I do assume that magic assists in my campaign - and a lot of magic in my world isn't the flashy stuff that adventurers do - but unless you have golems running around doing the manual labor I'm not sure how much of a difference it would make.

There is also something to be said for inguenity and technology.

You could mold earth, move the earth to a sifter, then sift the earth to get the root vegetables. Still needs some labor, but a lot less.

And while wagons can hold more, Wagons are not all-terrain vehicles, so the disc is useful there.

 

[Maxperson]

Except for the part that the lore tells us that Orcs/Goblins/Ogres/Ettins/Trolls/Hill Giants ect don't farm and constantly attack and raid the civilized people.

Not constantly, no. Orcs and goblins aren't everywhere and the others aren't common enough to constantly be raiding and attacking. It happens sometimes with orcs and goblins, but that's because there are PCs nearby to stop the raid or take revenge on the raiders.

And that ignores all of the bestial monsters that attack people like Wyverns, Bullettes, Ankhegs, Griffons, Harpies, Perytons, Ettercaps, Displacer Beasts, Luecrotta, Manticore, Owlbears, Girallons, ect

None of those would be much of a concern. They're rare and most of those creatures wouldn't do more than eat a farmer or two and leave. That's not a town raid.

And then you have all of the evil societies, evil dragons, demon and Devil attacks.

Evil dragon attacks are rare in the extreme. They aren't stupid enough to attack cities. Demons and devils are even more rare, and don't have the numbers on the prime plane to form a raid. Evil societies don't typically raid, either. Perhaps kidnap someone for a sacrifice, but they aren't going to be taking over towns the vast majority of the time. Those rare times when they do, it's because PCs are there.

Even if each thing is only a 1% chance of happening per year, you start getting into 50/50 odds when you consider how much stuff can go wrong.

Each thing doesn't have a 1% chance of happening. Nowhere close to it. As I pointed out, most of those creatures you mentions wouldn't even be raiding at all. Even at the less than 1% chance of going into civilized lands, they'd just nab a loner to eat and head away. More people would end up dead from murders than from these monsters.

 

[Oofta]

There is also something to be said for inguenity and technology.

You could mold earth, move the earth to a sifter, then sift the earth to get the root vegetables. Still needs some labor, but a lot less.

And while wagons can hold more, Wagons are not all-terrain vehicles, so the disc is useful there.

What percentage of the population can cast even a cantrip? In most cases it takes years of training. All for a minor advantage during harvest? When most people never went to school, much less got an advanced education?

A wagon can easily carry five times as much as a floating disc. Which, while handy is a first level spell that only lasts an hour.

Again, it's useful I just don't see it making a huge difference in most campaigns. It's not powerful enough to replace wagons unless wizards are a dime a dozen. But it just depends on the campaign where magic can be anything from something whispered about around the fire to having wagons that fly through the air drawn by magical steeds being normal.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

The complaint is that halflings are all farmers with no armies, knights, magic, tech, engineering, magic items, major organizations, political power, or wealth and mostly purposely avoid all of these culturally in world littered with monsters, evil humanoids, and dark lords.

Source!?

Lol no. Halflings are not all farmers. Wtf!?