D&D General why do we have halflings and gnomes?

[Chaosmancer]

In your world perhaps there is a connection. Not in any non-campaign-specific source book that I know of, certainly not for small villages of 100 or less being described.

Details like social structure and specifics of governance are left up to individual campaigns. If you're running a home brew campaign it's up to you to fill in those details as you see fit.

You know, I was going to argue something else, but here is a thought that occurred to me.

Where is all this free land that have these towns settling? Not just free land, free farmable, fertile land that is mostly completely safe from all monster attacks. Why isn't it controlled by someone? You've got roads, you've got trade networks, but you don't have large kingdoms? Or even lots of little kingdoms?

I mean, you are telling me there are acres and acres and miles and miles of unclaimed, fertile land, connecting major centers of power, that aren't under threat of monster attack, and no one is claiming them?

How? How do you justify that?

Where in any publication that was not campaign specific have you seen this?

Have I seen what? The idea that guards protect a village? Well, every single thing that is ever produced is set in a world, so it is automatically campaign specific. So, I'm not sure what you want from me here. Do you want me to say that Guards and Veterans don't exist in these villages?

That would go against your own post right here, I'll underline and bold it again for you

It's once every several generations for a race that lives on average to 150. Multiple generations, not one. I was assuming a generation was 50 years because of the lifespan. None of the lore really explains when they start having families so it's just what I would do for my home campaign.

There's no reason for halflings to not use weapons, the book doesn't forbid it. As with most races it doesn't really go into it. The same way that commoners of all races will use the best weapon available not just the stick clubs listed in the MM. There's also no reason they wouldn't have guards, veterans and so on although with 100 people or less it's not particularly likely.

And yet, the moment I said "that's what I was talking about" you immediately accuse me of demanding percentages of the population, and where in a non-setting specific publication have I ever seen mention of guards and veterans and so on in a village.

So... you said there is no reason they wouldn't have them, then attacked me for saying they would have them. Which is it?

Do they only have guards if I can find a standard percentage of non-setting specific rules for every single race in DnD that is a universal standard for all worlds? Or do they have them because, like you said, there is no reason not to. And plenty of reasons as I have pointed out to have them.

Do you agree with yourself or not?

 

[Chaosmancer]

In your game. In my game, a King is plenty capable if granting a small group or small groups of Halflings, exemptions. Nothing in RAW says one way or the other. Don't try to push your way on me.

And the Mary Sueism grows.

Protected by the Gods and granted tax exemptions by the King, I guess he just really loves those small rustic folk.

Good thing they don't have anything of value compared to those rich humans, what with their increased tax burden.

 

[Oofta]

Nope.
It has to interact with the world and make impacts.
Halflings are defined by their homebodiness. Gnomes hide and retreat. Half elves and half orcs are too few.

They do, or as much as any other small community will. They also have nomadic traders and settle in other communities. They have as much, or as little, impact as the DM wants them to have for their campaign.

Anyway ... I really don't know what you want so have a good one.

 

[Oofta]

You know, I was going to argue something else, but here is a thought that occurred to me.

Where is all this free land that have these towns settling? Not just free land, free farmable, fertile land that is mostly completely safe from all monster attacks. Why isn't it controlled by someone? You've got roads, you've got trade networks, but you don't have large kingdoms? Or even lots of little kingdoms?

I mean, you are telling me there are acres and acres and miles and miles of unclaimed, fertile land, connecting major centers of power, that aren't under threat of monster attack, and no one is claiming them?

How? How do you justify that?



Have I seen what? The idea that guards protect a village? Well, every single thing that is ever produced is set in a world, so it is automatically campaign specific. So, I'm not sure what you want from me here. Do you want me to say that Guards and Veterans don't exist in these villages?

That would go against your own post right here, I'll underline and bold it again for you



And yet, the moment I said "that's what I was talking about" you immediately accuse me of demanding percentages of the population, and where in a non-setting specific publication have I ever seen mention of guards and veterans and so on in a village.

So... you said there is no reason they wouldn't have them, then attacked me for saying they would have them. Which is it?

Do they only have guards if I can find a standard percentage of non-setting specific rules for every single race in DnD that is a universal standard for all worlds? Or do they have them because, like you said, there is no reason not to. And plenty of reasons as I have pointed out to have them.

Do you agree with yourself or not?

I'm done "discussing" this with you. Have a good one.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Because they lack ties to the ones in charge. Halflings would be fully under another race.

I want to pull this out, because this is exactly the problem being presented I think.

On one hand, I have @Maxperson 's interpretation. Halflings live in lands controlled and protected by human lords, and they are potentially exempt from all taxes because the King decides not to tax them. They have nothing of value, and are so well hidden from the world that they are only under threat once every 60 to 100 years, from a minor raid that really doesn't present much of a threat.

And on the other hand I have a question, what happens if there are no humans to protect them?

What happens if a Lord of the Dead overthrows the king, summons an army of the dead to sweep across the land, sowing terror and a blight that sucks the life out of the world.

Well, if I'm playing a character in a human village, I'm terrified. This is a threat to all of our lives. We need to figure out defenses against this horde, maybe find a way to break the Lord of the Dead's power. Because if we don't, our town is going to be wiped off the map.

If I'm a halfling... am I even worried? My village is so well hidden that it can't be found. The goddess lives in the plants so we won't be blighted. And the humans will likely take care of it, so... does life just continue as normal?

OR, do they react like the humans do. Is this a threat that could harm their existence?

And right now, from people's arguments, they are have all of the benefits of being protected by humans, none of the downsides of being connected to any government, and are so insulated form world events that an apocalyptic downfall of the human kingdom that is protecting them might not even register as something to be concerned about. Which makes it very strange. Usually, when you declare that "I'm going to go help them!" and the people in the village ask "why, it isn't our problem?" That is presented as them being short-sighted, because eventually it will be their problem, and their only allies will be gone. But for halflings as are being argued for... no really, why? It legitimately isn't their problem. They are safe if they do nothing.

And yet, at the same time, they are one of the top four races for adventurers? How? Every other race when faced with this threat is going to have to figure out how to deal with it. Only halflings seem to be protected and could just... continue to live their lives.

This is the problem I keep crashing into with this idea of idyllic shires cut off from the world. If nothing can touch them... then their motivations are completely different from every other being on the planet, because they cannot have the motivation to protect their home. Their home is always protected.

 

[Chaosmancer]

I'm done "discussing" this with you. Have a good one.

So you disagree with yourself.

No wonder I could I never get a straight answer to any questions I asked.

 

[Oofta]

So you disagree with yourself.

No wonder I could I never get a straight answer to any questions I asked.

There's no point in continuing this conversation. I've answered your questions a hundred times and I'm tired of the "gotchas".

Want a straight answer? Again? Halfling towns probably have as many guards and veterans as any other small communities in my campaign; in other words as many as are required for the storyline. You do whatever the **** you want in your campaign.

 

[Maxperson]

Who said anything about size. It's about inactivity.

They produce top 4 numbers of adventurers. In a game of adventurers, that's plenty activity. There's no requirement for races to be industrious like ants.

 

[Maxperson]

And the Mary Sueism grows.

Protected by the Gods and granted tax exemptions by the King, I guess he just really loves those small rustic folk.

Good thing they don't have anything of value compared to those rich humans, what with their increased tax burden.

lol Mary Sueism now?

 

[Maxperson]

I want to pull this out, because this is exactly the problem being presented I think.

On one hand, I have @Maxperson 's interpretation. Halflings live in lands controlled and protected by human lords, and they are potentially exempt from all taxes because the King decides not to tax them. They have nothing of value, and are so well hidden from the world that they are only under threat once every 60 to 100 years, from a minor raid that really doesn't present much of a threat.

And on the other hand I have a question, what happens if there are no humans to protect them?

From what?

If you mean something like there are no other races on the planet other than Halflings, then they develop much differently. Create that if you want it. We don't have that. We have a world with Humans, Dwarves, Elves and such that have lands and small Halfling villages that dwell in them.

What happens if a Lord of the Dead overthrows the king, summons an army of the dead to sweep across the land, sowing terror and a blight that sucks the life out of the world.

He gets stopped by the party of PCs, which has a very good chance of having a Halfling.

Well, if I'm playing a character in a human village, I'm terrified. This is a threat to all of our lives. We need to figure out defenses against this horde, maybe find a way to break the Lord of the Dead's power. Because if we don't, our town is going to be wiped off the map.

Sounds reasonable.

If I'm a halfling... am I even worried? My village is so well hidden that it can't be found. The goddess lives in the plants so we won't be blighted. And the humans will likely take care of it, so... does life just continue as normal?

Probably something close to normal, unless you live in town or city belonging to the Humans. You pointed out all of the big things that happened to the Realms. Humans take care of it. This is known.

And right now, from people's arguments, they are have all of the benefits of being protected by humans, none of the downsides of being connected to any government, and are so insulated form world events that an apocalyptic downfall of the human kingdom that is protecting them might not even register as something to be concerned about. Which makes it very strange.

They aren't protected by the Humans. They DO have the benefits of living in a civilized country, though.

And yet, at the same time, they are one of the top four races for adventurers? How? Every other race when faced with this threat is going to have to figure out how to deal with it. Only halflings seem to be protected and could just... continue to live their lives.

Yeah. It's a cool change to the rather boring and repetitive nature of the other major races.

This is the problem I keep crashing into with this idea of idyllic shires cut off from the world. If nothing can touch them... then their motivations are completely different from every other being on the planet, because they cannot have the motivation to protect their home. Their home is always protected.

Yep! Wanderlust and curiosity are the main motivations. Or whatever motivation you want them to have, since PCs can vary wildly from racial norms. Make a Halfling PC who thinks his race is crazy and doom is coming to them in their complacency.