Mars Rover Perseverance Landing... and continuing...

[Retreater]

I wanted to thank everyone for helping to fill the gaps in my knowledge. Seriously.

 

[Umbran]

Sigh, that somewhat misses the point, but sure.

Well, I dunno. The classic examples of slave-built multi-lifetime projects are pyramids, and they don't benefit the living, so are hardly examples of long-timescale projects for future generations.

Some of the projects I can think of were during very different socio-economic periods, where you didn't have to pay your labor for their time, but simply keep them alive. Others were not.

How many of those were vanity projects for the national leader, vs projects that were actually for the people? Tombs are out, for same reason as the pyramids. We can accept, say the Cathedral of Notre Dame as at least a building for public use. The Roman road network took a long time to complete, but it wasn't conceived, planned, or executed as a single project. For similar reasons, I don't think "building a city" counts as a single project.

 

[Ryujin]

Ideally, if we don't find life, or evidence of life on Mars, over the coming decades we become the life on Mars. What is being done now paves the way for that. I don't really think that anyone wants to go to Mars if we can't reliably get stuff to the surface in one piece, for example.

 

[trappedslider]

Remember we found life but it was covered by sector 7

Spoiler

 

[Imaculata]

Ideally, if we don't find life, or evidence of life on Mars, over the coming decades we become the life on Mars. What is being done now paves the way for that. I don't really think that anyone wants to go to Mars if we can't reliably get stuff to the surface in one piece, for example.

Indeed. One of the methods discussed for a possible longer stay on Mars, is to deliver prefab buildings and supplies ahead of said mission, so that everything is ready for when the first human visitors arrive.

In order to do that, we'd first need to be able to deliver objects to the surface of Mars reliably. But we'd also need a further study of circumstances on the surface.

 

[freyar]

I'm just really happy to see lots of people posting in support of basic science!

 

[Rabulias]

In order to do that, we'd first need to be able to deliver objects to the surface of Mars reliably. But we'd also need a further study of circumstances on the surface.

This. Heck, we build places on bad land here on Earth all the time (sinkholes, earthquakes, mudslides, etc.). We really need to find a stable place to build on Mars if we plan to go there.

 

[briggart]

Well, I dunno. The classic examples of slave-built multi-lifetime projects are pyramids, and they don't benefit the living, so are hardly examples of long-timescale projects for future generations.

If you are referring to the Egyptian pyramids, my understanding is that there is compelling evidence they were built by paid workers, not slaves, and that they were not just vanity projects, but they played a significant role in creating create a national/religious identity for the unified Egypt (though this may have been an unintended side effect).

 

[Umbran]

If you are referring to the Egyptian pyramids, my understanding is that there is compelling evidence they were built by paid workers, not slaves

When it gets beyond compelling evidence, and to consensus, then I'll change my position on that point.

, and that they were not just vanity projects, but they played a significant role in creating create a national/religious identity for the unified Egypt (though this may have been an unintended side effect).

I will accept that, much later, they became cultural icons, but that seems to me to fit in the unintended side effects bin.

 

[Arilyn]

There has been detailed archaeological work done in recent years on the lives of ordinary Egyptians, as well as ancient Egyptian social structure. Slaves were not employed in the building of the pyramids. This idea was popularized by Hollywood movies. They were paid, and there was a large infrastructure of rotating workers, made up of labourers, engineers, scribes, painters, etc. They found evidence of long dormitory type houses where the workers stayed, supported by rows of bakers and brewers. The work was incredibly hard and dangerous, as evidenced by the wear and tear we can see in the bones.

The first known recorded strike in human history took place during the reign of Rameses lll. The payment of grain was late.

This is off topic, but the building of the vanity projects in Egypt did provide paid work, as well as support for secondary businesses such as bakers, painters, brewers, and supposedly tool makers. So, there is a little similarity to the positive effects NASA has on the economy. Okay, it's mostly a side topic.