Blog (A5E) Keeping it Classy: Updated Core Classes in Level Up

[VanguardHero]

The problem is that it's not usually a "simple" fighter any more. It's a Fighter 2/Divine Soul Sorcerer X who casts fireball and then follows it up with spirit guardians.

That said, the humble fighter can still wreck their opposition with nothing but their training and a sword, the depiction of that training is just more varied and granular now.

I agree with this design change regardless, but did something change in the base 5e rules at some point to change the "Can only cast two spells on one turn if one is a Cantrip" bit? I always thought that was a limiting factor for the worst of Action Surge Multiclass Cheese.

 

[Benjamin Olson]

I agree with this design change regardless, but did something change in the base 5e rules at some point to change the "Can only cast two spells on one turn if one is a Cantrip" bit? I always thought that was a limiting factor for the worst of Action Surge Multiclass Cheese.

There was never such a rule. There is only a rule about what else you can cast if one of the spells is cast with the bonus action, and Action Surge has nothing to do with Bonus Actions.

 

[Timespike]

There was never such a rule. There is only a rule about what else you can cast if one of the spells is cast with the bonus action, and Action Surge has nothing to do with Bonus Actions.

Benjamin has it right. As long as you're not trying to wedge a bonus action spell in there, you can toss a pair of the highest-level spells you can cast with Action Surge under O5E.

 

[VanguardHero]

WOW that is some powerful RAW vs RAI, legitimately hilarious.

 

[Timespike]

WOW that is some powerful RAW vs RAI, legitimately hilarious.

Yeah, I wrote a whole article about that for the site, got it wrong, was rightly corrected by the forums, rewrote it, and now have nightmares about the crazy cheese that's possible under RAW. If the build and circumstances are just right, a Rogue(Thief) 17/Fighter 2/Sorcerer 1 with the right feats can get eight spells off in a single round.

 

[Stalker0]

Sure, but if someone publicizes a specific blog entry it seems like it should stand on its own, or at least try to link the reader to whatever they need for context. Maybe I'm ignorant, but presumably they want to sell books to ignorant people too.

Agreed. Regardless of how you feel about the article, it should not be colored by the playtest documents. The simple fact is, we don't know how much has changed since the playtest (and those documents don't exist online anymore for new people to reference). Second, we should assume there are several people that had no interest in playtests, but now that a real product is about to be born in the world....they want to see what the fuss is all about.

And so you should expect people to read this document as a standalone.

 

[Timespike]

Agreed. Regardless of how you feel about the article, it should not be colored by the playtest documents. The simple fact is, we don't know how much has changed since the playtest (and those documents don't exist online anymore for new people to reference). Second, we should assume there are several people that had no interest in playtests, but now that a real product is about to be born in the world....they want to see what the fuss is all about.

And so you should expect people to read this document as a standalone.

While the blog post could benefit from a hyperlink to the maneuvers post, the maneuvers post that Corrosive linked is from only 2 days prior and also includes laid-out sections from the books with full art. While it is not the entire maneuvers chapter, it's definitely not a playtest document, either.

EDIT: looks like someone from management agrees. The original blog post now includes a hyperlink to the maneuvers post.

 

[Sansang]

This, all of this, is just perfect.
Honestly I don't mind by the slightest strange multiclass combos at my table, so some of the things these designs were aiming to address were non-issues to me, but they ended up creating feature-sets way more interesting, free, and intriguing than the O5E classes. I appreciate in particular the discussion about Pally's utility.

I haven't understood one thing though: what does the fighter have to make it special? If every martial class have special maneuvers (which is amazing), what do they do different? I mean, if they are just "better" at it, it doesn't sound interesting enough.

 

[VanguardHero]

what does the fighter have to make it special?

I know Fighter is a Class Preview I am super looking forward to/hoping we get

 

[King Brad]

This, all of this, is just perfect.
Honestly I don't mind by the slightest strange multiclass combos at my table, so some of the things these designs were aiming to address were non-issues to me, but they ended up creating feature-sets way more interesting, free, and intriguing than the O5E classes. I appreciate in particular the discussion about Pally's utility.

I haven't understood one thing though: what does the fighter have to make it special? If every martial class have special maneuvers (which is amazing), what do they do different? I mean, if they are just "better" at it, it doesn't sound interesting enough.

If the playtest is any indication, certain classes can only pull from certain traditions for their maneuvers. Fighters have no such limitation and have extra exertion like the Adept does. They also get their own unique social features as well, like Steely Mien.