Level Up (A5E) What’s up with the Arcane and Divine spell schools?

[Faolyn]

Spells have those schools/tags; classes don't!

True. They just seem to be very haphazardly placed. I like the idea of the tags, but not the execution. They don't seem as integral as the tags in 3x did, and some of them--like the technological tag for antilife shell, or the chaos tag for levitate--seem so incredibly random. And I'm kind of at a loss as to why there's a nature tag and beast, plant, storm, and weather tags, or why there's a prismatic tag and a shadow tag but not a light tag, which seems to be would be more broadly useful. Stuff like that.

As it is, I think there's a few too many tags. I'm not sure the point of the damage-type tags, unless the online tools are going to be sortable by tag but not by damage type. I like the good/evil/law/chaos tag, but I'd like to know if casting a Good-tagged spell is actually considered to be Good in some way.

I think I may do as @SirApetus has done and just ignore them. The only place I've seen so far that needs them is the Holy Champion, and it'd be easier to simply create bonus lists of spells (and maybe for Chaos and Law, too, since those dudes need champions as well). There's probably more places where the sub-schools are used, but I haven't seen them yet.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I think you have to look at where these tags came from in the fiction. The classical schools can from ancient wizard tradition. The other tags came from literally everyone else's many different ways to categorize magic. In game, they represent a lot of different traditions that aren't necessarily connected to each other.

 

[Faolyn]

I think you have to look at where these tags came from in the fiction. The classical schools can from ancient wizard tradition. The other tags came from literally everyone else's many different ways to categorize magic. In game, they represent a lot of different traditions that aren't necessarily connected to each other.

Except that as they're written, they literally feel like a game-tag (to me, at least), not an in-universe attempt to categorize things. Which is why how they're used doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

 

[Timespike]

True. They just seem to be very haphazardly placed. I like the idea of the tags, but not the execution. They don't seem as integral as the tags in 3x did, and some of them--like the technological tag for antilife shell, or the chaos tag for levitate--seem so incredibly random. And I'm kind of at a loss as to why there's a nature tag and beast, plant, storm, and weather tags, or why there's a prismatic tag and a shadow tag but not a light tag, which seems to be would be more broadly useful. Stuff like that.

As it is, I think there's a few too many tags. I'm not sure the point of the damage-type tags, unless the online tools are going to be sortable by tag but not by damage type. I like the good/evil/law/chaos tag, but I'd like to know if casting a Good-tagged spell is actually considered to be Good in some way.

I think I may do as @SirApetus has done and just ignore them. The only place I've seen so far that needs them is the Holy Champion, and it'd be easier to simply create bonus lists of spells (and maybe for Chaos and Law, too, since those dudes need champions as well). There's probably more places where the sub-schools are used, but I haven't seen them yet.

All Herald subclasses use them.

Green Knight uses Nature and the Inquisitor uses Communication.

The 3PP project I'm working on has been using them pretty extensively, too.

 

[Faolyn]

All Herald subclasses use them.

Green Knight uses Nature and the Inquisitor uses Communication.

The 3PP project I'm working on has been using them pretty extensively, too.

Yes--but that still doesn't explain why certain sub-schools are assigned to certain spells--like why levitate is a chaos spell.

OK, let me explain. I've been having a crappy, anxiety-filled week, and one of my coping mechanisms converting things from one game or edition to another. I have no idea why this is calming, but it is. So I'm converting some spells from old Dragon magazines (which are in 1e, 2e, and 3x format) into LU format. While in many cases, assigning the sub-schools is relatively easy, there are also many times when it's very confusing, for the reasons I mentioned before. (Personally, I would have used a smaller list of sub-schools.)

Because it's confusing to me, I find it hard to know if a spell should really be in a particular sub-school--and as a result, if a Herald subclass should actually have access to the spell.

And I fully admit that this is a me problem, and it doesn't look like most other people don't have major problems with them. I'm just having a block with them.

 

[Praeden]

I was also confused by the tags when I read the Herald class, but then I forgot about them. They did seem a bit random. I prefer an uncluttered design space, but I appreciate that is no easy thing to accomplish when you have a couple of dozen designers working in their spare time to produce an advanced but broadly backward compatible version of something.

 

[SirApetus]

All Herald subclasses use them.

Green Knight uses Nature and the Inquisitor uses Communication.

The 3PP project I'm working on has been using them pretty extensively, too.

Nature is easy for me to replace if need, could just give some nature spells or just access to Druid Class Spell list.

Communication, I could just look at the spells that give those and give a few.

Not too hard to replace.


Or alternatively give each of those archetypes 1-3 spells for each level.

 

[WanderingMystic]

Pyromancer also grants all fire spells off of the top of my head.

I like having most of the spell schools but some of them as people are saying just don't make sense. I do love them for general teams life darkness, fire, water, mental, nature. It is the arcane diving and the law chaos that seem to be just all over the place.

 

[Faolyn]

Pyromancer also grants all fire spells off of the top of my head.

I have to wonder why, since they made the Arcanist where you specialize in a particular school, why they made Pyromancer and not Elementalist where you specialize in a particular element.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I have to wonder why, since they made the Arcanist where you specialize in a particular school, why they made Pyromancer and not Elementalist where you specialize in a particular element.

Yeah, I felt pyromancer was an odd choice for subclass.