Urban fantasy? (that isn't WoD)

[VelvetViolet]

Is anyone interesting in discussing, playing, and/or creating urban fantasy games that aren't World of Darkness (or it's spin-off Chronicles of Darkness either)? You know: vampires that aren't descended from the biblical Cain, vampires that don't have generational limits, werewolves that aren't ecoterrorists, werewolves that can infect muggles with a bite, wizards that don't demonize science as a lie created to enslave muggles, etc. There a huge conceptual space that can be explored here, so I'm astonished that there's just one game with one campaign setting (with several decades of unavoidable canon/lore baggage) that dominates 99% of the available scene. At least with D&D you have a bazillion campaign settings, retroclones, 3pp, etc that all take their own spins on rules and fantasy tropes.

 

[UngainlyTitan]

D&D operates in the liminal space between order and chaos. In the place between society and its constraints and the lack thereof. The characters have complete agency. This is very conducive to long campaigns. Not very realistic, which is why a lot of the early stuff was on literal frontier territory like the Caves of Chaos or places abandoned by society like the dungeons under Castle Greyhawk.
This has become so embedded in to D&D that no one bats an eye at random dudes taking it upon them selves to solve a murder in Waterdeep and the machinery of state going along with it.

Urban Fantasy generally operates as a Demi Monde outside regular society a bit like the criminal underworld but with even less contact with the muggles. This makes it harder to sell a long campaign (unless the characters are the forces of law and order) and even then is more suited to episodic or short form play.
You know how our society works so your suspenders of disbelief need to be much stronger. Steampunk probably works better, it is that little more alien.

 

[VelvetViolet]

D&D operates in the liminal space between order and chaos. In the place between society and its constraints and the lack thereof. The characters have complete agency. This is very conducive to long campaigns. Not very realistic, which is why a lot of the early stuff was on literal frontier territory like the Caves of Chaos or places abandoned by society like the dungeons under Castle Greyhawk.
This has become so embedded in to D&D that no one bats an eye at random dudes taking it upon them selves to solve a murder in Waterdeep and the machinery of state going along with it.

Urban Fantasy generally operates as a Demi Monde outside regular society a bit like the criminal underworld but with even less contact with the muggles. This makes it harder to sell a long campaign (unless the characters are the forces of law and order) and even then is more suited to episodic or short form play.
You know how our society works so your suspenders of disbelief need to be much stronger. Steampunk probably works better, it is that little more alien.

There’s a bazillion urban fantasy novels that we could use as inspiration, couldn’t we? It’s a very diverse genre. There’s Vampire Chronicles, Anita Blake, Dresden Files, Harry Potter, A Discovery of Witches, etc. I’m bursting at the seams with ideas.

 

[Jer]

I love the idea of Urban Fantasy for an RPG. And I have a few on my shelves - besides the WoD games you mention there's also the Dresden Files RPG and the Buffy/Angel RPGs (which, shockingly, still seem to be in print!) in the "licensed urban fantasy" properties area. And there's also Monster of the Week and Urban Shadows in the "not tied to a property" area. And there's also Scion from Onyx Path (formerly from White Wolf) which is urban fantasy American Gods style. There are others that are no longer in print - Nephilim, In Nomine, and Urban Arcana (d20 Modern) all come to mind. To a degree Shadowrun is "urban fantasy" though since it's also cyberpunk I don't think most folks think of it that way.

The trick with Urban Fantasy games IME is that they have a tendency to either become "mystic superhero" games or investigative horror with superpowers games. Until I read the Dresden Files series I thought it was just me and the groups I'd played with, but the arc of Harry Dresden from investigative horror detective to mystic superhero is right there, so I know now it's not just me and my groups.

(The one exception to this in my own personal experience was a Vampire game I played in in college that basically fell apart as everyone was pursuing their own agendas and the GM couldn't figure out how to get us all into the same adventure and instead of just forcing the issue he tried to run everyone's side adventures individually and the game eventually just fell apart due to lack of time on everyone's part, especially his.)

 

[payn]

I love the idea of Urban Fantasy for an RPG. And I have a few on my shelves - besides the WoD games you mention there's also the Dresden Files RPG and the Buffy/Angel RPGs (which, shockingly, still seem to be in print!) in the "licensed urban fantasy" properties area. And there's also Monster of the Week and Urban Shadows in the "not tied to a property" area. And there's also Scion from Onyx Path (formerly from White Wolf) which is urban fantasy American Gods style. There are others that are no longer in print - Nephilim, In Nomine, and Urban Arcana (d20 Modern) all come to mind. To a degree Shadowrun is "urban fantasy" though since it's also cyberpunk I don't think most folks think of it that way.

The trick with Urban Fantasy games IME is that they have a tendency to either become "mystic superhero" games or investigative horror with superpowers games. Until I read the Dresden Files series I thought it was just me and the groups I'd played with, but the arc of Harry Dresden from investigative horror detective to mystic superhero is right there, so I know now it's not just me and my groups.

(The one exception to this in my own personal experience was a Vampire game I played in in college that basically fell apart as everyone was pursuing their own agendas and the GM couldn't figure out how to get us all into the same adventure and instead of just forcing the issue he tried to run everyone's side adventures individually and the game eventually just fell apart due to lack of time on everyone's part, especially his.)

I did my first Monster of the Week game a few months ago. Was interesting how it played out for us. One player wanted it to be like leverage, another wanted it to be like Supernatural, and I went with Fargo. The GM split the difference and it worked out to be the investigative horror with superpowers you betcha.

 

[Ixal]

Depending on how far you stretch the definition Shadowrun would also be Urban Fantasy (although dystopian cyberpunk would be a better fit) where magic has integrated a lot more with normal society (Vampires and werewolfs being both victims of the same virus which causes your soul to slowly bleed away unless refilled through feeding on others. There is a lot of prosecution, but also research to develop viable substitudes. And magic is an acknoledged part of life, taught at schools for those that have the gift like the MIT&T and there is an industry for spellcasting).

Most urban fantasy settings keep the mundane and fantasy world separate and hidden for some reason.

 

[Jer]

I did my first Monster of the Week game a few months ago. Was interesting how it played out for us. One player wanted it to be like leverage, another wanted it to be like Supernatural, and I went with Fargo. The GM split the difference and it worked out to be the investigative horror with superpowers you betcha.

What's funny is that the Icons RPG I'm running is going in the reverse direction. It started as a mystic superhero game but because of the kinds of characters the players rolled, their backstory ideas, and the choices they've made it's rapidly becoming an "investigative horror with superpowers" game.

Sometimes I wonder if modern era games just naturally want to become investigative horror games or if its me or just the people I tend to play with. (The same thing happened with my long running TORG game back in the day - the plot threads the players really liked were the horror ones and so it slowly became an investigative horror with superpowers game.)

 

[payn]

What's funny is that the Icons RPG I'm running is going in the reverse direction. It started as a mystic superhero game but because of the kinds of characters the players rolled, their backstory ideas, and the choices they've made it's rapidly becoming an "investigative horror with superpowers" game.

Sometimes I wonder if modern era games just naturally want to become investigative horror games or if its me or just the people I tend to play with. (The same thing happened with my long running TORG game back in the day - the plot threads the players really liked were the horror ones and so it slowly became an investigative horror with superpowers game.)

I love both creating mysteries to run, and try to solve mysteries that GMs create. I do this in almost any RPG I play. So, it doesn't surprise me its a strongly desired game loop for others too.

 

[Jer]

I love both creating mysteries to run, and try to solve mysteries that GMs create. I do this in almost any RPG I play. So, it doesn't surprise me its a strongly desired game loop for others too.

It's the "horror" part that baffles me a bit I guess. I get the investigative part - in a modern setting especially mystery solving is a game loop that works - but that even in a setting as variable as the multiversal mishmash that is TORG or the superheroic DC-comics inspired world for our Icons game that my players will still go for the horror angle over the more sci-fi or fantasy ones when given a choice is interesting to me.

 

[payn]

It's the "horror" part that baffles me a bit I guess. I get the investigative part - in a modern setting especially mystery solving is a game loop that works - but that even in a setting as variable as the multiversal mishmash that is TORG or the superheroic DC-comics inspired world for our Icons game that my players will still go for the horror angle over the more sci-fi or fantasy ones when given a choice is interesting to me.

The horror angle is interesting. I think the investigative point is just so central to the genre. There is always a political/historical angle to the horror genre. Even slasher flicks usually have the whole library microfiche scene planted. Another part of it is the danger involved. When you are facing something stronger, meaner, and without your total understanding its a rush. You can do that with supers, but its often so outlandish its not believable. It lacks a certain vicarious feeling that horror often delivers. IMO