D&D (2024) 2024 Wings

[Yaarel]

I am aware of how powerful flight in itself can be.

The slot 3 Fly spell deserves its slot 3 (at least).

The requirement to spend an action makes the Wings cantrip significantly less powerful (thus a lower slot) than the slot 3 of Fly.

Below are the "excellent" cantrips.

• Guidance
• Eldritch Blast
• Minor Illusion
• Mind Sliver
• Vicious Mockery
• Frostbite

Ideally, when a char-op tends to choose one of these cantrips instead of the Wings cantrip, then Wings as a cantrip will be powerful but moreorless balanced.

I find the concentration mechanic non-useful as a restriction. In my experience, concentration doesnt really matter at lowest tier, but at higher tiers concentration creates huge difficulty. This is the opposite of the kind of limitation that I want for Wings. Wings should be difficult to use at the lowest tier, but easy to use at the higher tiers. At the upper tiers, flight should be normal for most characters, and actually having Wings should serve this normativity.

The inability to hover intentionally limits the utility at the lowest tier, but at higher tiers is less necessary as a restriction.

Hypothetically, the Wings speed could be 10 feet per proficiency bonus, thus 20 to 60 across tiers.

 

[Benjamin Olson]

So far as cantrips on the Primal spell list goes, it's strong, but it's pretty niche compared to Guidance (everything is). That said I would argue that having both out of combat and in combat utility makes it a top tier cantrip pick already even if the utility weren't flight, which many people rate as a very powerful ability.

 

[the Jester]

No way I'd allow flight as a cantrip. There are certain things that should be a bit harder to obtain IMHO.

 

[Yaarel]

Based on tentative considerations, I am ballparking the following.

• The wingspan requires about one size larger.
• One must move a 30-foot line on foot, to achieve liftoff.
• The flight speed starts off at about walk speed 30.
• But it can eventually reach a cruising speed of say fly 300.

I am unsure what to do with these fast cruising speeds, but they are a reallife thing for birds and other flyers.



Here is the largest reallife animal to ever fly: the prehistoric Quetzalcoatlus northropi. It compares to the size of a (Huge) giraffe.

The head seems surprisingly large. But, roughly speaking, the wings here seem to need a wingspan about twice as wide as the creature is tall.

The flight speed of Quetzalcoatlus remains controversial, but credible estimates have upper speeds reaching 55 or 80 miles per hour, soaring and flapping for days at a time. The minimum flight speed of the Quetzalcoatlus maybe 10 miles per hour, where it starts to fall if slower than 10 miles per hour. (I am unsure how it achieves liftoff. Does it run? Dive?)

10 miles per hour is roughly 88 feet per 6 seconds, or at least speed 90.

55 miles per hour is roughly 80 feet per second, or speed 480. 80 miles per hour is roughly 117 feet per second, or roughly speed 700.

So the flight of the Quetzalcoatlus starts at roughly D&D speed 90 without hover, and can eventually reach maybe speed 600.



The largest flying bird alive today is Otis tarda, the great buzzard, whose males can reach (Small) almost 3½ feet tall with a wingspan of almost 9 feet. Here, the wingspan is a bit more than twice the height. It achieves flight speeds of upto 29.83 mph (43.74 ft/s, or 262 feet per 6 seconds) to 60.89 mph (89.31 ft/s, or 536 feet per 6 seconds). So in D&D terms, the upper speeds of the Otis is something between speed 270 to 540. As far as I can tell, the Otis needs to make a brief running start to achieve liftoff.



In D&D, a human can move 30 feet per 6 seconds, or 5 feet per second. This is about 3.4 miles per hour, which is a reasonably accurate human walking speed.

The dash action doubles this walk to speed 60, hence roughly 6.8 mph, which is comparable to a jog. The fastest human sprinters reach bursts of over 23 mph, 33.73 ft/s, or D&D speed 200. This extreme sprint is over 6x the walk speed, but average people can only reach about speed 120, which is 4x the walk speed.

 

[Charlaquin]

Based on tentative considerations, I am ballparking the following.

• The wingspan requires about one size larger.
• One must move a 30-foot line on foot, to achieve liftoff.
• The flight speed starts off at about walk speed 30.
• But it can eventually reach a cruising speed of say fly 300.

I am unsure what to do with these fast cruising speeds, but they are a reallife thing for birds and other flyers.



Here is the largest reallife animal to ever fly: the prehistoric Quentzalcoatlus northropi. It compares to the size of a (Huge) giraffe.

The head seems surprisingly large. But, roughly speaking, the wings here seem to need a wingspan about twice as wide as the creature is tall.

The flight speed of Quetzalcoatlus remains controversial, but credible estimates have upper speeds reaching 55 or 80 miles per hour, soaring and flapping for days at a time. The minimum flight speed of the Quentzalcoatlus maybe 10 miles per hour, where it starts to fall if slower than 10 miles per hour. (I am unsure how it achieves liftoff. Does it run? Dive?)

10 miles per hour is roughly 88 feet per 6 seconds, or at least speed 90.

55 miles per hour is roughly 80 feet per second, or speed 480. 80 miles per hour is roughly 117 feet per second, or roughly speed 700.

So the flight of the Quentzalcoatlus starts at roughly D&D speed 90 without hover, and can eventually reach maybe speed 600.



The largest flying bird alive today is Otis tarda, the great buzzard, whose males can reach (Small) almost 3½ feet tall with a wingspan of almost 9 feet. Here, the wingspan is a bit more than twice the height. It achieves flight speeds of upto 29.83 mph (43.74 ft/s, or 262 feet per 6 seconds) to 60.89 mph (89.31 ft/s, or 536 feet per 6 seconds). So in D&D terms, the upper speeds of the Otis is something between speed 270 to 540. As far as I can tell, the Otis needs to make a brief running start to achieve liftoff.



In D&D, a human can move 30 feet per 6 seconds, or 5 feet per second. This is about 3.4 miles per hour, which is a reasonably accurate human walking speed.

The dash action doubles this walk to speed 60, hence roughly 6.8 mph, which is comparable to a jog. The fastest human sprinters reach bursts of over 23 mph, 33.73 ft/s, or D&D speed 200. This extreme sprint is over 6x the walk speed, but average people can only reach about speed 120, which is 4x the walk speed.

Note that Earth had a thicker atmosphere when Quetzalcoatlus was around. If Jurassic Park happened and Elon Musk genetically engineered a Quetzalcoatlus, it probably wouldn’t be able to fly today. To fly, you need enough lift to overcome your weight and enough thrust to overcome your drag. Fewer air molecules means less lift and less drag, but for a big heckin’ chonker like Quetzalcoatlus, weight is the much bigger issue.

 

[Frozen_Heart]

• One must move a 30-foot line on foot, to achieve liftoff.

Ironically you picked a pterosaur to look at for the example here. Animals which could quad launch into the air from a stationary start.

Though yeah, for larger birds or even worse, animals with 4 limbs and 2 wings, running take-off makes a lot more sense.

 

[Cadence]

Now I'm imagining one that also made your bones temporarily hollow and what the combat implications of that would be....

Good Question: Could humans fly if we had wings? - East Idaho News

Most of us are a little jealous of birds. We’ve wanted to be like our avian friends for a long time, as evidenced by the story of Icarus and Leonardo da Vinci’s sketches of birds and his flying machine ideas. Yes, today we can fly — but not by flapping our arms. But with all …

www.eastidahonews.com

 

[Aldarc]

Note that Earth had a thicker atmosphere when Quetzalcoatlus was around. If Jurassic Park happened and Elon Musk genetically engineered a Quetzalcoatlus, it probably wouldn’t be able to fly today. To fly, you need enough lift to overcome your weight and enough thrust to overcome your drag. Fewer air molecules means less lift and less drag, but for a big heckin’ chonker like Quetzalcoatlus, weight is the much bigger issue.

Not to mention that the flight mechanics of Quetzalcoatlus has no real relevance about whether or not Wings should be a cantrip in the context of D&D 5e.

 

[Kobold Avenger]

My general idea for freely flight in some races such as Tieflings, Aasimar and Air Genasi is that while it might be available as a 1st level legacy/sub-race option to some if DMs allows it. For others it would be a 4th or 8th level feat that one can pick up to get flight or an "extra legacy" option to include legacy/sub-race options that were restricted at 1st level.

 

[TwoSix]

To point out the (flying) elephant in the room, at-will flight at level 1 is already a racial ability in 5e. So, officially, the "should you do this" portion of the question is already answered.

The question then becomes is a cantrip slot enough of a cost for an at-will ability with limited combat use until higher tiers? I guess I could see some abuses if every party member picks it, but would there really be any parties that prioritize such abuses? Especially for a druid/ranger/Magic Initiate only cantrip?