D&D General What does the mundane high level fighter look like? [+]

[Oofta]

Just because another universe portrays something narratively different in their story, it doesn't mean it fits into current D&D mechanics. Those were-hyenas are not D&D 5E were-hyenas. They are either lower CR creatures with much fewer HP, or if we want to make a 4E comparison, they are merely minions. That doesn't mean Conan or D&D warriors need to deal 50 damage with every pommel hit or unarmed strike.

If 5E created a minion category, would that actually make martial characters feel better? I'm not sure they would. Because magic AoEs will still be more effective against larger groups of minions. Not without the martials getting more of their own AoE "powers".

I could be wrong.

I don't want, or need, minions in my 5E game. If I want to set up a scenario where a higher level lone fighter is fighting off a pack of enemies, it's easy to do. They won't be were-hyenas, there are plenty of other options.

 

[Tony Vargas]

If 5E created a minion category, would that actually make martial characters feel better? I'm not sure they would. Because magic AoEs will still be more effective against larger groups of minions. Not without the martials getting more of their own AoE "powers".

I could be wrong.

Minions in 4e were the most fun for controllers, like the Wizard, who had the biggest AE spells, that didn't necessarily do all that much damage. Martial AE exploits tended to be a lot smaller & more limited, typically adjacent enemies you could see, if you were a melee type. So, no, a rule like minions wouldn't fix things in 5e, since non-casters aren't even close to 4e controllers, while basically all casters are that, and more.

What minions did accomplish, tho, that very-low-CR creatures don't in 5e, is to present a higher-level challenge that's dangerous but still quick to deal with. And BA gets in the way of that, because it shifts scaling from attack/def to damage/hp. And, it's a particular issue for martials, since they scale damage via Extra Attack.

 

[Minigiant]

They still cleave through lower level monsters quickly, it's just not necessarily in one blow for a CR 2 monster. Not when you could throw in a CR 1/4 or 1/2 monster if you want them to be mowed down like grass. I fail to see the issue. I also think it doesn't make any sense to compare specific gameplay mechanics with fiction.

So you are saying the mechanics don't match the fiction.

Because who is using CR1/2 rabble against level 15+ parties as a meaningful threat.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

So you are saying the mechanics don't match the fiction.

Because who is using CR1/2 rabble against level 15+ parties as a meaningful threat.

They work just fine alongside more powerful foes. The same role than the 4e minions had, but without the inelegant kludge of minionising.

 

[Minigiant]

They work just fine alongside more powerful foes. The same role than the 4e minions had, but without the inelegant kludge of minionising.

Do they don't.

CR1/2 have low accuracy and negligible damage to high level targets.

ESPECIALLY if you reward magic armor.

 

[Oofta]

So you are saying the mechanics don't match the fiction.

Because who is using CR1/2 rabble against level 15+ parties as a meaningful threat.

That's what mob rules are for. Of course those rules are in the DMG so not surprised if you haven't ever read them.

 

[Oofta]

Do they don't.

CR1/2 have low accuracy and negligible damage to high level targets.

ESPECIALLY if you reward magic armor.

Which is one of the reasons magic armor is rare in my campaign.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Do they don't.

CR1/2 have low accuracy and negligible damage to high level targets.

ESPECIALLY if you reward magic armor.

Sure they do. A CR 1/2 has a +5 to hit. Most high level PCs still have ACs in the high teens. And magic armor is pretty rare in 5e. Sure, the fighter types might be OK, but most other classes can still be hit with relative frequency. Especially if you have a whole bunch of CR 1/2 mooks.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Magic items tend to benefit fighters more than they do wizards in my experience. After all you can have magic weapons, armor, shields all without attunement.

Which is one of the reasons magic armor is rare in my campaign.

 

[Vaalingrade]

1HP, average damage, doesn't explode if they save vs AoEs.

Man, look at all that kludge. Ten whole words. eleven if you count acronyms, which you know we do not in this house.