D&D 5E (2024) Snarf's Complete Two Weapon Fighting and Grappling Guide

[UngeheuerLich]

I have a question:

I think there is a way to read the light and nick property that you don't need the feat at all:
The light weapon property is on both weapons. So both weapons could enable a second attack with the other weapon if used during the attack action. The light property never states that it can only be used once per turn.

Using two nick weapons might even allow two nick attacks, depending on the reading.

Another reading allows only ONE bonus action action per attack action. And nick just changes the action economy) Then using action surge at least should allow for one extra light weapon property attack at least. (Which I think is a better reading).

 

[Plaguescarred]

I don't see any way to read as ever making more than one extra attack of the Light property, with or without Nick mastery, it's the same done as part of the Attack action instead of a Bonus Action, and is limited to once per turn wether it does or not.

I also think it's possible to equip and unequip one weapon when you make any attack with the Attack action, not just one per Attack action. Likewise you can equip a Thrown weapon everytime you attack with one. You also have one free item interaction as part of your action or movement.

 

[Horwath]

A Duel-Wielding Fighter with Extra Attack(4)+Light/Nick+Action Surge seems NUTTY!

it's really not,
TWF is actually worst style for a fighter.
you only get one extra "off hand" attack, and even if you take the feat(that anyone can take) you still get only one extra attack as Bonus action.

 

[Plaguescarred]

The extra attack of the Light property and the extra attack of Dual Wielder feat are different.

While both uses the same ressource to make them, they can mutually be used when Nick mastery shift the extra attack of the Light property as part of the Attack action instead of a Bonus Action.

 

[Clint_L]

Monks are better at grappling. However, it's hard to actually be good at it.

My hard won experience with trying to play a Monk with the Grappler feat is that it's very unreliable, due to the changes to grappling. On the attacker's side, the DC is now set to spell standard, with no way to cheese it higher. And on the defender's side, instead of making an Acrobatics or Athletics check (which most monsters lack proficiency with), it's a Str or Dex save. The defender's choice, even. And it turns out a lot of creatures in the MM have a good score in at least one of those two.

Now yeah, YMMV and this depends a lot on encounter design habits. But my two cents from actual play is that grappling is highly unreliable as a main combat tactic, even with the feat.

Monks are very good at grappling now - I think @ECMO3 has a good description of how his monk fights with it in a recent thread. I agree that its usefulness depends on encounter design - my campaigns involve a lot of humanoid opponents. If you are up against a lot of large, powerful monsters it will be much less effective, for example. But I think that makes sense.

With the new design, you have to basically look at grappling like a control spell, and apply accordingly. But when used judiciously, it’s an extremely powerful tool in the 2024 rules, and monks can arguably use it better than any other class because it synergizes so well with the rest of their toolkit.

 

[evilbob]

Those "off-hand" attacks you are getting with your extra weapon? You don't get to add your ability modifier to the damage. So in (1) and (2) above? If Chad's main weapon attack would do 1d6+3 (16 in relevant score), the second attack would do 1d6. Unless Chad takes two-weapon fighting (the fighting feat), in which case all of Chad's attacks get to add the ability modifier, so Chad always does 1d6+3.

Mr. McClure, I have a question about your recent indictitement involving fish. But before that, I have to point out the the TWF feat does not add your ability modifier to ALL attacks. It only applies to the one extra attack granted by the light property! This means that the bonus action attack granted by the Dual Wielder feat does not benefit.

So poor Fighter Chad at level 5 with TWF, DW, two scimitars, and the nick mastery is going to have 3 attacks with one attack action - all of which add his ability modifier to damage - and then one sad little extra bonus action attack, which does 1d6 and nothing else. At this point, Chad should be questioning whether or not all those feats were a wise choice, because they give him very little.

This is also why Chad is jealous of his Ranger friend Mattie, who has access to Hunter's Mark, which makes all of her extra attacks actually do something. Chad can also pick up Hunter's Mark with Fey-Touched for the cost of another feat - and an ability point that can't help with TWF - but not until level 8, which is a long time to wait for your build to be good.

 

[ECMO3]

nm

 

[ECMO3]

Monks are better at grappling. However, it's hard to actually be good at it.

Monks are awesome at Grappling. The best class I have seen since the 2024 rules came out.

There are a few reasons for this:

1. The Punch and Grab part of the Grappler Feat is ideal for Monks. Sure any PC with the Grappler feat can do it, but others have to make a relatively weak unarmed strike attack to do it, while a Monk unarmed strike is a high damage "regular" attack.

2. Being Stunned makes enemies automatically fail strength and dex saves, meaning they are automatically grappled if you attempt a grapple against a stunned enemy. So a Monk that hits someone with stunning strike can automatically grapple that guy with his next attack or with his bonus action.

3. Monks high movement means they can be more effective at dragging enemies around the battlefield.

4. Flurry of Blows and your bonus action attack can be used to grapple or prone an enemy and you can do this before your attack action. So if you use your bonus action to prone a guy then with extra attack you have two shots to grapple him and with the feat you can do that after an unarmed attack

My hard won experience with trying to play a Monk with the Grappler feat is that it's very unreliable, due to the changes to grappling.

This is not my experience at all. If you hit an enemy and land stunning strike he is automatically grappled. If he makes his save against SS or you don't attempt a SS he still has to save against the grapple attempt.

The only thing that has gimped my Monk when it comes to grappling is huge and larger creatures.

The Feat I think that gets hyped a lot but is not that great on a Monk is Tavern Brawler.

There were characters in 2014 that were more reliable when it came to grappling (especially Rogues with expertise and Barbarians), but they were giving up a lot more to do it than a Monk is in 2024.