D&D (2024) 2024 needs to end 2014's passive aggressive efforts to remove magic items & other elements from d&d

[cranberry]

and the issue with the new way is that there is not even an attempt at fair power distribution. I am not seeing progress here

Yea, I agree. There are some classes that are noticeably more powerful than others. Hopefully the new version that's not a new version will fix that.

 

[Minigiant]

Mingiant: please consider switching from claiming "magic items are required" to "I hate the game without magic items". You should find that you can proceed to the next phase of your argument much faster

I don't hate games without magic items.

My argument is and always has been:

• The DM tools for 5e were half-butted (because WOTC were forced to rush the DMG and didn't personally care for some stuff that would go into it).
• WOTC pretended that the DMG wasn't an unenthusiastic, disorganized, and/or rushed mess until they decided to print a new DMG in 2024.
• The Magic items system, due to it both being a DM side feature and deemed optional, was poor and caused for many new DMs as it does not explain its eccentricities onto the 5e skeleton if the DM wanted to run something off the base assumption.
• Running magic items was common so running off the base assumption was common.
• Not running magic items was the base assumption but the system was itself based on a system that ran magic item, adding more confusion

Or in laymen terms. WOTC didn't give themselves enough time to do magic items right but they pretended they did until they had another DMG to sell

 

[CreamCloud0]

I don't buy Minigiant's claim the lack of magic weapons create insurmountable problems.

that's fair, but i think a good many of us agree that the issues caused by a lack of magic weapons shouldn't ought to be solved by the dependence on the abilities of another class/character.

 

[Minigiant]

Anyway. Unless I'm mistaken you're trying to argue 5E doesn't work without magic items. I would say this is the only time it comes close to its envisioned balance point, and that the more feats and magic items you add the more work it is by the DM to keep some semblance of balance...

That's what I'm saying.

Unless you ban 50-75% of the content, official 5e as printed doesn't work without magic items. But magic items themselves warp the game so you are using a tool that gives you more work as a DM to offset some of the extra work the base game gives.

 

[tetrasodium]

I did what the DMG said

“Use common sense to determine whether more than one of a given kind of magic item can be worn”

You can disagree with my conclusion if you want to, but for me one of each, two rings is the common sense result.


not to me, that is you making an exception because you want to, I do not want to make one … this is basically the slots you asked for with permission to overrule them.


First, then why are you asking for slots when they change nothing… Second, they will not get that exception from me


so what, I do not need one and you can use a different sheet that does if you consider it one

I do not see the problems you are bringing up.

Common sense is neither common nor sense. There's not a whole of sound judgment going on these days (though whether it is worse than in the past, I can't be sure), so it's not common. If common sense was common, then most people wouldn't make the kinds of decisions they do every day.

-1764​

 

[Yaarel]

I can see how that would be a useful section(s) if it was well supported. IME players will often start out filling in that kinda stuff in the features & traits section (new players especially) but the size of that little box quickly winds up being too cramped to usefully record much at a readable font size beyond maybe names & page numbers for a lot of PCs as they start moving into tier2levels & beyond. Something like that might almost need a full page (or close) for it to record name: charges per [time unit or whatever] & some details about the ability.
capable subclass

The character sheet design needs to accommodate both a lot of space for the list and good categorization. It is a challenge because it is uncertain how many actions will be in each category.

For me, it helps for the action list to feature six (or sometimes three) "favorite" go-tos actions for each category. Then add any extra actions below the feature or nearby, depending on how much space an action description requires.

Weapons normally go in the At-Will section of the action list, including one or two favorite weapons in the feature. Notably, combat cantrips function like weapons and belong in this same location. Likewise, favorite spells typically go in the Per-Long-Rest category. A separate box for tracking spent spell slots is somewhere nearby.

Plus features from background, species, and feats assign add according to their category.

 

[mamba]

Not running magic items was the base assumption but the system was itself based on a system that ran magic item, adding more confusion

it was not the base assumption, as any WotC adventure shows

 

[mamba]

If common sense was common, then most people wouldn't make the kinds of decisions they do every day.

I agree, it is not as common as the name implies. That is why the DMG text continues “A character can't normally wear more than one pair of footwear, one pair of gloves or gauntlets, one pair of bracers, one suit of armor, one item of headwear, and one cloak.”

 

[MonsterEnvy]

That's what I'm saying.

Unless you ban 50-75% of the content, official 5e as printed doesn't work without magic items. But magic items themselves warp the game so you are using a tool that gives you more work as a DM to offset some of the extra work the base game gives.

Could you explain to me what doesn't work without magic items?

 

[Yaarel]

I agree, it is not as common as the name implies. That is why the DMG text continues “A character can't normally wear more than one pair of footwear, one pair of gloves or gauntlets, one pair of bracers, one suit of armor, one item of headwear, and one cloak.”

Body slots on the character sheet make this self-evident.