It's been so long since the last GURPS edition, that the present day is now in the "future" tech level

[Thomas Shey]

I just wanted to note that I found your response mostly fair and reasonable, @Argyle King, and felt that any parts I had responses to would be, at best, nit picking.

To make it clear, I think the "learning how the parts fit together before discarding them" necessity is far from limited to GURPS; my first experience with that sort of thing was over 40 years ago, and was with RuneQuest. My only point is that if you find some of GURPS rules too much, either you may be intimidated by not being sure you understand the implications of changing them (if you have a sensible view that most systems have mechanics that interlock to some degree), or alternatively don't have sensible view, fiddle with a part you don't understand, break something, and get discouraged. And to make it clear again, not the only complex game system with this potential problem; I suspect people trying to thin out the Hero System without thoroughly understanding it would be in for, well, some bad experiences.

 

[innerdude]

I have to say that a thread about GURPS has a positive life to it here at ENWorld is very nice.

** Stands in corner with a pained grimace, but takes the high road and says nothing. **

 

[Argyle King]

I just wanted to note that I found your response mostly fair and reasonable, @Argyle King, and felt that any parts I had responses to would be, at best, nit picking.

To make it clear, I think the "learning how the parts fit together before discarding them" necessity is far from limited to GURPS; my first experience with that sort of thing was over 40 years ago, and was with RuneQuest. My only point is that if you find some of GURPS rules too much, either you may be intimidated by not being sure you understand the implications of changing them (if you have a sensible view that most systems have mechanics that interlock to some degree), or alternatively don't have sensible view, fiddle with a part you don't understand, break something, and get discouraged. And to make it clear again, not the only complex game system with this potential problem; I suspect people trying to thin out the Hero System without thoroughly understanding it would be in for, well, some bad experiences.

My perspective is that GURPS somewhat intends that you don't use everything.

I think one of the best (and Free yes, free) products for the system is GURPS Lite. It cuts a 2-volume set down to 32 pages.

It's not perfect, but it helps illustrate which rules are at the heart ("loadbearing" as it were) of how things work.

I mention After the End a lot because I believe those pdfs do a great job of breaking the game down into a specific style of play -and one that uses guns in a simpler way without sacrificing the flexibility of GURPS. It also presents the game at a lower (and more manageable) point total than Dungeon Fantasy.

There's a guy on YouTube who does pretty good educational GURPS videos:
That's a link to a video of him using GURPS to play through Lost Mines of Phandelver. I haven't watched it yet myself, but I likely will at some point.

He also has videos about using guns. He approaches those particular videos differently than I would approach teaching a new player, but it's still a good resource. He has videos on a wide variety of topics, and most of them give at least a basic idea of how things work.

 

[MGibster]

That's a link to a video of him using GURPS to play through Lost Mines of Phandelver. I haven't watched it yet myself, but I likely will at some point.

The first time I played the original I-6 Ravenloft module for AD&D we used GURPS.

 

[Argyle King]

The first time I played the original I-6 Ravenloft module for AD&D we used GURPS.

That's pretty cool.

When I was first learning the system, I played online with a GM who ran Against the Slave Lords using GURPS 4th Edition.

I highly enjoyed the experience. To be honest, I had the fortune of the GM being one of the best GMs (either in person or online) with whom I've ever gamed, and that helped.

I'm not sure what ever happened to the person who was the GM, but, if they're still out there somewhere, I hope other people have the fortune to play with them as well.

That experience was a bright spot during an otherwise rough time, and it helped teach me a game that I've been enjoying ever since.

 

[dbm]

GURPS was my favourite system for decades, and is still in my Top 3. I think it is most suited to games with nuanced characters doing more than just a series of combats. If I wanted to run a game about investigation which focussed on the investigating (as opposed to the apprehension of perps) then GURPS is probably the system I would reach for. I personally would also run it ahead of Call of Cthulhu for a horror game.

For pulp, I reach for Savage Worlds, but for more grounded games GURPS would be my choice for sure.

To pick up on a couple of points in this thread, you are most definitely not intended to use all the optional rules in GURPS. Many are mutually exclusive. The other thing I would say is that you can always choose to play down the precision presented and use basic difficulty rating instead. The system will take that and hold together. When I am teaching GURPS I do two things. First, I make the character stats for the player based on their description of how they want the character to be. Second, I start really simple: all hits in combat go to the body and everyone uses the base ‘move and attack’ option. As soon as someone wants to achieve something like focussing on defence rather than attack, or they want to do a called shot, I will then tell them there is an option to do that and how it works. That way complexity builds slowly and only comes up as it adds value for the players.

The series ‘How to be a GURPS GM’ is one I would highly recommend for anyone wanting to learn or master the system.

 

[John Dallman]

To pick up on a couple of points in this thread, you are most definitely not intended to use all the optional rules in GURPS. Many are mutually exclusive. The other thing I would say is that you can always choose to play down the precision presented and use basic difficulty rating instead. The system will take that and hold together.

Yup. The moving parts of the system are more visible than in many game systems, but they have fewer hidden interactions. There are a couple of articles about running GURPS without using most of the rules in issue #5 of The Path of Cunning, a fanzine I co-edit.

 

[Retros_x]

I'm not at all convinced by this timeline. I feel we are not quite in TL8 yet, which in the version of GURPS I had was supposed to start around 2000, but where we are maybe having a hint we might reach if we don't slide into another Dark Age.

TL8: Personal computers, global network. We have both since the 90s, I am not sure how you feel were are "not quite in TL8 yet".

 

[John Dallman]

TL8: Personal computers, global network. We have both since the 90s, I am not sure how you feel were are "not quite in TL8 yet".

You're using 4e TL8; he's using the 3e TL8. They are different, confusingly so.

 

[Celebrim]

You're using 4e TL8; he's using the 3e TL8. They are different, confusingly so.

More to the point, when I bought the rules and played we were according to the rules TL7 and TL8 was "the future", and the future could be recognized by things being "different". There was going to be "game changing" technology in TL8. And the thing is, everything now just feels like slightly evolved versions of stuff we've had since the 1970s if not earlier. There have been zero obvious advances in science, zero new things, just miniaturized or faster versions of old things. I'm not sure when things evolve sufficiently so that we can say the memory sticks we have now are a full tech level above a floppy disk, or the PCs we have now are a full tech level above a 286. It's not like having Fusion Power or Mars Bases or Cybernetic Interfaces or something we just didn't have before that you can put on a list as markers that identify the tech level.