The D&D 4th edition Rennaissaince: A look into the history of the edition, its flaws and its merits

[Joshua Randall]

So we can get to the real issue- that 2e was terrible and a real betrayal of 1e! AMIRITE?

2e literally, and I mean LITERALLY literally, not the stupid use of that word as a superlative, 2e LITERALLY asked “Who dies?” Regarding 1e classes!!!!1!111!!111!!!!eleven!

(I know, I know: Zeb Cook did this specifically to provoke a response, but I couldn’t resist.)

 

[Zardnaar]

Do not diss 2e, Snarf. They had the best bards.

Best Gnomes as well. Hang on that's my pet hate.

 

[Joshua Randall]

Virtually no one plays high level anyway any edition.

4e LFR had 4-5 years of high level play, so you are objectively wrong here.

 

[Joshua Randall]

You were arguing with the article at the beginning and that did set a tone for the thread.

The article makes obvious mistakes that invalidate it from the get-go.

And then you decided, “Y’know, I’ll wait a week or so then show up to mention how much I hate 4e and compare it to a board game, because surely my unique take on this situation is of great value.”

Get over yourself.

 

[Joshua Randall]

We get it, you're bitter. That much is evident.

No, I am righteous. There is a difference.

Though, was this a + thread about 4E? Did I miss something?

No, because + and 4e are not allowed.

Pretty sure the original post was about an article

The original post was simply a URL, a drive-by shooting of the type I didn’t know we allowed here, but I guess we do.

you just decided this (again, non plussed thread) is sacrosanct.

What is sacrosanct is
(1) it’s a game
(2) people’s tastes in games differ
(3) going into someone else’s space to tell them how much their tastes suck and that their games sucks is f—king rude
(4) I am never going to stop defending 4e, never.

 

[Zardnaar]

4e LFR had 4-5 years of high level play, so you are objectively wrong here.

LFR?

I did say virtually. 1% according to WotC.

 

[BrokenTwin]

4E is the only D&D game I have played/GMed that still functioned at high level play.

 

[eyeheartawk]

I choose to use my daily power: Being fun at parties.

 

[Zardnaar]

4E is the only D&D game I have played/GMed that still functioned at high level play.

It's not really high level as such. It's level 3 to 10 stretched over 30 levels heavily nerfed.

Look at the powers in the 4E phb they're roughly on par with 5th level spells. Right there in black and white.

May as well streamline the game to 10 levels at that point and avoid the hit point bloat.

Kinda similar to B/X vs BECMI

 

[Kannik]

That's a very good summary and I agree that WotC's rollout of 4e could be taught in a business class as an example of how to do everything wrong about the rollout of a new product alongside something like 'New Coke'. But, you don't even mention what I would put as the major thing that turned me off the product, and that was the core of their marketing was around what a piece of garbage 3e was. Every article and announcement that they made about the product they spent time trashing their own existing product and decrying it as a bad product.

As an example of just how much everything can be in the eye of the beholder... I'd began playing with AD&D. Moved onto 2e, 3e, and 3.5e. Decades of gaming. And what I saw of the 4e marketing landed very much for me as a combo of tongue in cheek and knowing/loving/ribbing this hobby we've had for a long time. It never occured to me as trashing or put down.

(That said, I will concur that this line of marketing/announcement was a super bad idea! It's akin to satire -- at least 23% or so of people will take the satire at face value or as an endorsement of what's being satirized. Poking fun at yourself works great when poking fun at yourself, and or amongst your friends, but it's a very very VERY dodgy move to do at a larger scale like advertising. )