D&D General If we were re-designing the Tiny Hut-esc 'instant shelter' spells what would we change?

[James Gasik]

Im not sure what galder's tower is but very much agree that the current rest rules themselves are very much a part of the problem that caused these spells to become so overpowered.

Galder's Tower

3rd-level conjuration (Wizard spell)

Casting Time: 10 minutes
Range: 30 feet
Components: V, S, M (a fragment of stone, wood, or other building material)
Duration: 24 hours

You conjure a two-story tower made of stone, wood, or similar suitably sturdy materials. The tower can be round or square in shape. Each level of the tower is 10 feet tall and has an area of up to 100 square feet. Access between levels consists of a simple ladder and hatch. Each level takes one of the following forms, chosen by you when you cast the spell:

• A bedroom with a bed, chairs, chest, and magical fireplace
• A study with desks, books, bookshelves, parchments, ink, and ink pens
• A dining space with a table, chairs, magical fireplace, containers, and cooking utensils
• A lounge with couches, armchairs, side tables and footstools
• A washroom with toilets, washtubs, a magical brazier, and sauna benches
• An observatory with a telescope and maps of the night sky
• An unfurnished, empty room

The interior of the tower is warm and dry, regardless of conditions outside. Any equipment or furnishings conjured with the tower dissipate into smoke if removed from it. At the end of the spell’s duration, all creatures and objects within the tower that were not created by the spell appear safely outside on the ground, and all traces of the tower and its furnishings disappear.

You can cast this spell again while it is active to maintain the tower’s existence for another 24 hours. You can create a permanent tower by casting this spell in the same location and with the same configuration every day for one year.

At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 4th level or higher, the tower can have one additional story for each slot level beyond 3rd.

Source: The Lost Laboratory of Kwalish

 

[Merlecory]

Im not sure what galder's tower is but very much agree that the current rest rules themselves are very much a part of the problem that caused these spells to become so overpowered.

There is very much a reason why wizard has tiny hut and it's tied to resting rule changes. I'm not going to go back to check the exact wording but wizard had to meet a fairly high bar in order to study and prepare spells. In 3.x that bar was something like "a good night's sleep" plus some amount of time (1hr?) spent in peaceful uninterrupted study. Im ad&d2e it was something like ten minutes (1hr?) of quiet uninterrupted study per spell level of the spell being prepared for each spell.
With 5e they deleted that whole need and a few related concepts like vancian prep. That deletion left these iconic spells in a state of function without purpose & wotc decided to change the purpose to tickling munchkin fantasies rather than restoring function by fixing the problem they created through charges to resting and recovery

The 2014 wizard needs to spend 1 minute/level of spell for each spell they prepare. I suspect that those rules aren't tracked/enforced very often. I don't remember it coming up much in my 3.5 days, but that was a while back...

 

[cbwjm]

The 2014 wizard needs to spend 1 minute/level of spell for each spell they prepare. I suspect that those rules aren't tracked/enforced very often. I don't remember it coming up much in my 3.5 days, but that was a while back...

I think 3e was 1 hour of study all up, same as BECMI, but when it comes right down to it, everyone in games I've run or played in for every edition typically just allow spells to be prepped after resting and don't worry too much about actual time.

 

[tetrasodium]

I think 3e was 1 hour of study all up, same as BECMI, but when it comes right down to it, everyone in games I've run or played in for every edition typically just allow spells to be prepped after resting and don't worry too much about actual time.

Just going to add that cleric had something similar with prayer but had weapons and armor along with more hp.

I saw it come up fairly often under specific situations. Namely " we are going to [tempt fate] and rest here [because folks were a bit too trigger happy with spells or reckless/unlucky with their hp] even if it's not a good idea". If there is an interruption like an attack on the camp during that hour it would bork recovery for the relevant PC or could be a notable challenge without being significant timesink because some of the PCs opted to say "nope, I as the party's controller/blaster/healer am going to ignore that and keep studying/praying.

Party goes back to town or treks wayyy away from the dungeon to find a safe spot where they can hole up & it just got handwaved after accomplishing whatever is involved in reaching that safe spot. The same was true in my 2e experience unless there was something off about the town like being under siege or whatever but I can't remember anything more than a "let's stack the odds and cross our fingers by doing this stuff first" type thing

 

[tetrasodium]

The 2014 wizard needs to spend 1 minute/level of spell for each spell they prepare. I suspect that those rules aren't tracked/enforced very often. I don't remember it coming up much in my 3.5 days, but that was a while back...

I'm not going to check the book and just going to assume this is accurate. Even if true that one minute is too short of a period to have any impact and afaik the whole thing is missing the "hey players check yourself and play it safe if you push your luck" weasel words about things like the quality of rest and conditions for study that were there in past editions.. it results in a scenario where the window is too tiny to be a plausible concern and too flexible to matter even if it gets hit

 

[James Gasik]

I'm not going to check the book and just going to assume this is accurate. Even if true that one minute is too short of a period to have any impact and afaik the whole thing is missing the "hey players check yourself and play it safe if you push your luck" weasel words about things like the quality of rest and conditions for study that were there in past editions.. it results in a scenario where the window is too tiny to be a plausible concern and too flexible to matter even if it gets hit

Here's the relevant section from the 2014 PHB:

Note that this is only for changing out what spells you have prepared. Replenishing the spell slots themselves happens after completing a long rest.

 

[TiQuinn]

So the spell says it's a hemisphere. I envisioned it as a sphere sliced in half, so it doesn't have a floor. But Jeremy Crawford, in a tweet, said "oh no, it does have a floor", which was brought up to me when I tried to have some incorporeal undead come up from the ground. As it was an Adventure League game, I was forced to abdicate, even though I disagreed with that interpretation.

Which…just…ugh. Jeremy Crawford’s off the cuff tweets were never meant to be authoritative or errata, and I put the blame solely on him for being completely mealy-mouthed about his intent with them. It’s a total gap in the spell’s description and either interpretation can be correct, leaving it totally to the discretion of the DM and their table.

 

[Lanefan]

I played a gnome caster who once cast Rope Trick under a throne to hide from guards. You just need to cut the rope short.

Since then we put rope trick under tables. Mainly because its really hard to see with detect magic or see invis when it has physical cover and you need to crawl on the ground.

As for strenuous...the party lies under the table, cast the spell, then stand up into the hole while holding the rope. Sit on the extradimensional surface, then swing your legs in. Not strenuous at all. And getting out is just lying down. Also not strenuous.

Easy solution for those shenanigans: rule that the opening has to be at least 5 feet above the nearest solid surface below. (in 1e it was 10 feet, locked in)

 

[Lanefan]

I have to admit, I've never really had much issue with Rope Trick. It's a pretty rare scenario where short rests are difficult to take anyway. Most of the time, taking an hour rest is not exactly difficult. Sure, I know there are times when it's not, but, typically, if you can't take a short rest, Rope Trick probably isn't going to help you anyway since there's a time pressure.

And, heck, short rests only really benefit the non-full casters anyway. It's not like you get a whole lot of spells back on a short rest.

I'm used to the 1e version of Rope Trick, that lasts for hours.

My beef has always been with Tiny Hut, particularly when players start gaming it to use it as an invulnerable fighting point. I was so tired of it in the last campaign I simply ruled that all force affects are completely opaque. You can drop a Tiny Hut, but, you can't see out of it. And no LOS means it doesn't work as an offensive position.

While I like this force-is-opaque for Leo's Hut it seems to defeat the best aspect of Wall of Force, that being to make an invisible immovable barrier for things to crash into at full speed.

 

[Lanefan]

Can you just dig under the edge of a tiny hut? It creates a dome shaped force. Is that a globe that surrounds you underground as well?

It almost has to be more than a strict hemisphere in order to allow it to be cast on non-level or rough ground.