D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

My patience comment was in reference to @BrokenTwin's post #632 which reflects that his latest RPG provides a number of non-traditional options for one's character's heritage which means his views must have changed.

I honestly think it is about settings...if you grew up with Dragonlance not having orcs and Mystara not having giff then you're likely not going to start promoting lore that alters that original version of those settings. New settings do not have lore-luggage issues.

EDIT: And he does reference settings quite a bit in that post.
The PHB was often the manual for these a-e D&D worlds. Now you introduce 2 species alien to the lore of these worlds, you're bound to have push back. Time passed, new worlds, new lore, less pushback.
Yeah, I can see that. Changing things that have previously been established is always going to be harder to accept than developing something new. The bigger the change, the greater the pushback. And when some of those changes clash with your fanbases' deeply held personal beliefs, then watch out, because they will take those changes as personal attacks on themselves.
 

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No. I want you to poll every D&D player so we can get accurate data about how much Thac0 was liked or hated. But barring that Herculean task, you can just assume some level of generalization is acceptable and the fact you are not part of it doesn't mean the generalization is faulty.
Where are you getting your impression of Thaco from? From the same kind of personal experience from which mine comes? Internet memes? Why am I supposed to assume the truth of what you're claiming?
 


On the orc thing, just give the orcs they encounter recognisable names and throw in some cool colour...sorts whatever issues one has with orcs.
Durotan, father and proud warrior, motions his axe threateningly in your direction as if marking you. He is somewhat tired from the tenday scouting exercise, but pushes the exhaustion aside as he eyes your wares, eager to be able to show something for his latest expedition. He deftly dodges your thrust as you close the distance and he retaliates with a surprisingly low swing at your thigh. He is careful not to damage your boots which he wishes to claim afterwards.

I did something similar for a half-orc opponent and the rest of the players were rooting for the NPC half-orc to best the PC half-orc. :ROFLMAO:
 

Yeah, I can see that. Changing things that have previously been established is always going to be harder to accept than developing something new. The bigger the change, the greater the pushback. And when some of those changes clash with your fanbases' deeply held personal beliefs, then watch out, because they will take those changes as personal attacks on themselves.
In business, the word is values, and that a product should align itself with it's primary consumers values to appeal to them. D&D has done that successfully. At the same time people getting their values from corporate America is sort of ugh. Ultimately the pushback has been for a small, yet vocal segment, not unusual as it's a specialty product, with a lot of brand identification. Hasbro WOTC was essentially right to ignore them though, too small of a segment to be focused on vs getting new customers.
 


Where are you getting your impression of Thaco from? From the same kind of personal experience from which mine comes? Internet memes? Why am I supposed to assume the truth of what you're claiming?
I was reading Usenet boards when alt.tsr.dnd was active. I read Dragon magazine letter sections though the 90s. I've been active on Enworld since 2003 and was lurking since Eric Noah was running a spoiler page. I have lurked on Dragonsfoot, was a member of my local college gaming society and spent an untold amount of my youth in game stores. Do not cite the Deep Magic to me, Micah. I was there when it was written.
 

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