D&D 5E (2024) Unconfirmed Dark Sun World Book

[mamba]

From a corporate publishing angle, can we be sure DS is a success?

it sold better than Spelljammer or Planescape, both of which already have remakes. Whether it made a profit is anyone’s guess

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

Hasbro doesn't want to update DS to sell more sourcebooks but to use the IP for different types of products, mainly a future videogame style BG3.

And it is the harderst to be updated because both crunch and fluff. The banning of classes and PC races is against the philosophy of 5e and the lore is not "family-friendly" for 5e standards.

My theory is the crunch will be updated, the lore partially retconected to justify the "new" class options and mainly the unlocking in DM Guild.

I suspect now WotC is more like a IP farm.

We can't know what is their roadmap for 2026 because not even they don't it when they are hiring new staff.

If there is a future DS then there are an update of psionic powers but this also should mean a new UA playtesting for the psionic PC species: elans, maenads, xephs, dromites, synads, shardminds and fraals, and also original PC species like the mulzhennedar(muls), tari(ratfolk) or Athasian genasi(ember, magma, sand and sun).

* I don't like the idea of zones around the region of Tyr couldn't be playable for low-level PCs. And I can't explain the reason because if there are +20level nPCs theses and Sorcerer Kings didn't face in the past.

* What if there is life-shaping or biopunk tech to can purify water or to create food without arcane magic? This could allow the fundation of secret underground realms that could hide to survive the cleasing war.

 

[Misanthrope Prime]

2E Dark Sun was, in fact, not a success on a financial angle. Ben Riggs made that pretty clear when he uncovered TSR sales data.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking. And I don't know if anything from 4e can be called a success.

 

[Parmandur]

it sold better than Spelljammer or Planescape, both of which already have remakes. Whether it made a profit is anyone’s guess

Spelljammer and Planescape were easier sells with less overt problematic elements, I reckon.

 

[mamba]

Spelljammer and Planes ape were easier sells with less coert problematic elements, I reckon.

probably, the ‘issue’ with DS for me is that a setting it is so different from the kitchen-sink settings of 5e that they will have a hard time making everything fit into the world, and they probably do not want to exclude half of their races and classes like they did in the 2e days.

Guess we will see what 2026 brings. I almost expect more of a ‘Subclasses of the Multiverse’ than a ‘Dark Sun 5e’ book because of how they turned preserver and defiler into two subclasses rather than an overarching principle of all arcane casters, but maybe they just did that for the playtest so they could get feedback on their ideas

 

[humble minion]

probably, the ‘issue’ with DS for me is that a setting it is so different from the kitchen-sink settings of 5e that they will have a hard time making everything fit into the world, and they probably do not want to exclude half of their races and classes like they did in the 2e days.

I think races and classes are probably the easy bit. You can do a 'soft' exclude like Dragonlance did, just have a sidebar talking about how X, Y, Z races are the most appropriate and talk to your DM if you absolutely desperately want to play something else.

There's fundamental elements of 5e that are harder to gloss over though. Goodberry and Create Water make wildneness survival near-trivial. As far as I know, WotC has never put any restriction on spells in any setting, this would be a definite departure. Similarly, the sheer prevalence of cantrips or quasi-magical abilities that 5e provides is a poor fit for Dark Sun where magic is rare and (generally for good reason) despised. I guess you could re-skin stuff like an Arcane Archer's class abilities to be psionic in nature and just kinda wimp out and bypass the whole issue, but that does genuinely undermine the attitude to magic that is at the core of the setting.

 

[mamba]

There's fundamental elements of 5e that are harder to gloss over though. Goodberry and Create Water make wildneness survival near-trivial. As far as I know, WotC has never put any restriction on spells in any setting

I agree that these are also issues. To me they are part of the evolution of D&D however, they did not exist in DS because they did not exist in 2e, in 5e they do so they will also exist in DS 5e, at least that is my expectation. I definitely would prefer if they provided weaker versions or banned them outright, but then I would prefer that for generic 5e as well.

 

[humble minion]

I agree that these are also issues. To me they are part of the evolution of D&D however, they did not exist in DS because they did not exist in 2e, in 5e they do so they will also exist in DS 5e, at least that is my expectation. I definitely would prefer if they provided weaker versions or banned them outright, but then I would prefer that for generic 5e as well.

I'm fuzzy on Create Water, but I'm 99.9% sure that Goodberry at least DID exist in 2e. The kicker was that you had to provide fresh berries as a material component that the spell consumed, which limited its usefulness in Athas. I think it was 2nd level too.

Besides, the big deal was that in 2e you actually had to devote a spell slot at preparation time to your Goodberry spell. None of this 5e stuff where you just prepare a subset of your spells known and then decide what spells to use on the fly. If you want to cast Goodberry, you had to commit to that ahead of time and that's one less Cure Moderate Wounds or whatever you'd have if you got into a fight (and there's no hit dice healing on a short rest so you'll NEED that spell). Much, much higher opportunity cost in 2e than there is under 5ed, and there's a LOT of 5e fundamentals making it that way.

 

[mamba]

I'm fuzzy on Create Water, but I'm 99.9% sure that Goodberry at least DID exist in 2e. The kicker was that you had to provide fresh berries as a material component that the spell consumed, which limited its usefulness in Athas. I think it was 2nd level too.

Besides, the big deal was that in 2e you actually had to devote a spell slot at preparation time to your Goodberry spell. None of this 5e stuff where you just prepare a subset of your spells known and then decide what spells to use on the fly.

Much, much higher opportunity cost in 2e than there is under 5ed, and there's a LOT of 5e fundamentals making it that way.

you are correct on all counts

 

[Staffan]

I agree that these are also issues. To me they are part of the evolution of D&D however, they did not exist in DS because they did not exist in 2e, in 5e they do so they will also exist in DS 5e, at least that is my expectation. I definitely would prefer if they provided weaker versions or banned them outright, but then I would prefer that for generic 5e as well.

Create water definitely existed in 2e, as a 1st level spell conjuring 4 gallons/level. Dark Sun modified the spell to only conjure half a gallon per level, and it was only available to priests with access to the sphere of Water (which meant clerics of Water, druids whose guarded land was Water-based, or templars). Create food and water was also restricted to half a gallon of water per level.

Goodberry was a 2nd-level spell which you needed to cast on freshly picked berries (which would be an issue in Dark Sun). It was not altered for Dark Sun, but it also only ever provided equal nourishment to a meal per berry, so you'd still need to drink.