Dungeons & Dragons releases Villainous Options playtest

Whizbang Dustyboots · Saturday at 11:42 PM

Kurotowa said:
The problem is that the Ravenloft book isn't in the Fall. It's in mid-June, barely more than two months from now. And that means it's way too late to be circulating brand new content for it. Those books have to be in late editing and typesetting, if not already at the printer's. Maybe they could manage it for a digital only release, but something that has to be physically manufactured and shipped? No chance.

And this looks more meaty and substantial than any first-party digital-only releases from WotC to date.

Minigiant · Saturday at 11:56 PM

Assuming 16 rounds of Combat as only 40% of a Martial Class Death Knight getting a saving throw failure, that's just 3 DPR per person hit.

But DPR ain't nothing.

5 point Hellfire Orb is 70 damage. More than Chain lightnings 45 or Circle of Deaths 36 but the AOE is sooo much lower than it would be a much harder opener to hit more than 2 monsters.

Chain lighning will often get 4 targets than Heellfire Orb's getting a 3rd.

But nice for a martial.

Paul Farquhar · Sunday at 6:57 AM

Stormonu said:
Everyone keeps saying this is “Book of Vile Darkness” stuff, but I feel like this is material we’ll see in the Ravenloft book this fall.

I didn’t say it was for a Book of Vile darkness, I said it was for a book featuring both light and dark paths. Possibility “Champions” themed. Good paths next month.

As others have said, one thing we know is it is far too late for it to be in Ravenloft, which is probably already at the printers.

Arcana Unleashed and Deadfall are the books scheduled for the fall, with a “champions” related title for Christmas.

Okland · Sunday at 3:36 PM

Kurotowa said:
I looked at Barbarian, and found most of the features are no better.

Even if you use point buy to start with Con 16, until you raise it you're only getting AC 13 + Wis mod. In other words, the same as the much cheaper Mage Armor option. It only climbs ahead at higher level, and I distrust anything that doesn't come online until 13th level.

The shield and weapon masteries are rendered irrelevant in Titan form. Maybe you could stipulate a humanoid enough form to still use them when you're Large, but without a clause that makes them scale with you there's no way my group would let a Huge Behemoth benefit from Medium sized gear. And having a Huge shield you only deploy right as you shapeshift would be incredibly gimmicky. Besides, if it's just shields, Druids already get those.

Rage fails because it requires you to attack with Str (Titan form does not) and only applies to weapons and Unarmed Strikes (which Titan form technically doesn't use). If 20 super hot gratis was any way to apply it to Titan form's Rend, I'd be all for it. But I don't see a way to make it work. The forms don't grant a Natural Weapon, they grant a special Attack Action.

It feels like the devs leaned way too hard into the flavor of the Titan form without actually checking if the core Barbarian kit supported it. Unless your DM is willing to hand-wave the "Medium gear" restriction or let Rend count as a Strength attack, the whole multiclass just feels like a trap. Definitely seems like sticking with pure Druid is the play if you want to actually feel powerful before level 13.

Mistwell · Sunday at 3:55 PM

At least Stoneskin is on the Titan spell list. That should help with survivability.

Kurotowa · Sunday at 4:40 PM

Okland said:
It feels like the devs leaned way too hard into the flavor of the Titan form without actually checking if the core Barbarian kit supported it. Unless your DM is willing to hand-wave the "Medium gear" restriction or let Rend count as a Strength attack, the whole multiclass just feels like a trap. Definitely seems like sticking with pure Druid is the play if you want to actually feel powerful before level 13.

It usually is. Honestly, IMO most multiclass ideas are gimmicks that overly focus on optimizing a single stat while ignoring the lost opportunity cost to everything else. It's very rarely a net gain, especially if you're a full caster.

I think the only one in 5.5e where I unambiguously nodded along saying "Yeah that makes sense" is Bladelocks starting with a level in Fighter. And that's more an indictment of how flawed the Bladelock package is, even after the revisions.

Paul Farquhar · Sunday at 4:51 PM

Okland said:
It feels like the devs leaned way too hard into the flavor of the Titan form without actually checking if the core Barbarian kit supported it

They have never designed around multiclassing, they have always been caveat emptor. But it would do no harm to suggest the attack be switched to strength in the feedback.

abazaba · Sunday at 5:24 PM

Remathilis said:
The Titan Druids lore blurb is classic Godzilla.

I usually skip reading through the actual UA's, primarily because I seem to have enough problems remembering the official rules as-is without getting playtest material mixed up with that. But now that you (and others) mentioned Godzilla I just had to read through at least that part of this UA, and now I wanna be Gojira.

Remathilis · Sunday at 5:32 PM

Paul Farquhar said:
I didn’t say it was for a Book of Vile darkness, I said it was for a book featuring both light and dark paths. Possibility “Champions” themed. Good paths next month.

As others have said, one thing we know is it is far too late for it to be in Ravenloft, which is probably already at the printers.

Arcana Unleashed and Deadfall are the books scheduled for the fall, with a “champions” related title for Christmas.

I don't understand how people can expect WotC to release a UA, give a two week playtest window, gather feedback for another two weeks, take all the feedback and comments, sort that data into usable information, then go back to the drawing board to incorporate feedback, internally playtest it, then place in the manuscript and typeset it, proof it several times, and have the book ready to go to the printer in what basically is a less than half a year. WotC is good, but not miracle workers!

Then again, if you are convinced UA is for marketing and not for feedback, I guess you can cut out a whole "reading and analysis" part and the book could be ready tomorrow.

This stuff is for 2027. Not Ravenloft. Not Arcana Unleashed, not "Champions". Champions will need to be finalized this summer to get enough books ready for print. They won't even have this feedback all gathered until May. That gives them no time for major changes, let alone playtesting.

So unless you really think WotC did a bang up job with transitioning the purple dragon knight to the banneret, it's for the best this be a 2027 book.

Parmandur · Sunday at 5:59 PM

Remathilis said:
So unless you really think WotC did a bang up job with transitioning the purple dragon knight to the banneret, it's for the best this be a 2027 book.

I mean, that shows that it is possible, yes.