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needs some refinement, some thematic work, and I want that unable to ever die thing from the mystic to be in there for no reason other than to make the one caster you do not have to worry about. Chartreuse is my present vote.

dude I was not allowed near any of my family's copies of that I watch the films and play video games. they have more or less stayed unchanged for decades, as fantasy has not moved much on dwarves.

basic but not unworkable

holy hell, this feels like a miracle.

The point is that dwarfs have a definition in the fantasy zeitgeist, goliaths do not. Some definition is what I want something to work with. Remember it is always some dms first time, thus it helps to make it so they do not have to fly by the seat of their underwear.

easter dragons have rather different connotations than Western dragons do; they are arguably not even the same sort of thing

have you never seen people creatively choke up with a blank sheet of paper?

see the lack of clarification makes it harder to do sure I want open-end options, but I also want a template for when I just need them to be something, also a trope is not a template onto itself.

okay working from that tell me what a goliath is then?

my point is we can't at present do that at all nor subvert expectations as none have been made.

Most of those settings were built for past editions, so I do not hold it against them, they were fine when they were made.

you got me on the abilites but the cosmetics amount to being big. It is more I want to see something to work with if someone wants to lean into it and not have to start from scratch. imagine if a goliath was with the fellow ship of the ring what would they be doing?

then why even have the option beyond the stats that are now gone?

It is certainly my problem, it is the gnome problem How do you integrate something that seems to have no past, present or future?

I have no issue with that, but a guiding option is helpful. It is both always someone's first game and someone's first time with the concept, having a path of least resistance for when you just need an answer is helpful. I get everyone is a blank slate but there also on the macro level a blank...

I also remember one where four of them went against heaven to save people from a drought and were punished by being crushed under mountains, but turned themselves into rivers so as to still help people.

it is more they have no setting that focuses on them is more my issue if we have one to work off everything is fine but no patter and you just have a stat block

You assume my dislike and snark at the present situation is the same as what I wish were the case. No, however some of us do not do well with a blank sheet with no clear idea how to make use of it, and goliaths do not inspire much at present, I wish for that to change.

I think they are some sort of relates species just not part of the giant giants, more like trolls and ogres, just not terrible.

It is more that they are still sacred and still worshipped beings thus the grounds is far more rocky than the western dragon, which is basically just a monster. I want innovation, but also the classic flavour. I also want the carp that turns into a dragon as I like the determination those guys...