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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    Where is the answer to the test supposed to come from - the player? or a proper interpretation/application of the Tenets and Concitions? I don't know the answer to my question, because I don't know the game you're talking about. But here is a post upthread that talked about this issue using...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    4e D&D is replete with "narrative" leaning ideas. Here's an old thread about some of them: D&D 4E - Pemertonian Scene-Framing; A Good Approach to D&D 4e
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    I was responding to your "requires". And as I posted way upthread when you said a similar thing, I disagree about "allows". It's pretty clear to me that a lot of action declaration in "trad" play happens in author stance: the players declare actions not because that is what their character...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    This is like saying that, if you succeed on your to hit and damage roll in D&D, and thus reduce the Orc's hp to zero, the GM decides that the Orc is dead. Unless you're playing a very high-fudge game, that description would be inaccurate: the GM, like everyone else, comes to know that the Orc is...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    What about the barter? This s not just a throw-away difference. It's fundamental!
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    Right. I posted an example from my own play way upthread: post 3218. This reminded me of the old White Dwarf Traveller scenario The Sable Rose Affair. The PCs play mercenaries. They are retained to infiltrate a conspiratorial pirate network based out of a night club (The Sable Rose). The...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    All I'm saying is that, if you want to see how "fail forward" might be used in 5e D&D, @hawkeyefan has provided some examples.
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    The player acted on their hope. The rules were applied to work out whether or not it is fulfilled Huh? That's not accurate at all. The player declared their action, and it was resolved by a dice roll. Again, this is a complete misdescription. It contradicts both what I have posted about the...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    But this isn't true. It's possible to play narrativist using actor stance almost exclusively. I've done this, using AD&D and Rolemaster. And as I've posted upthread, when I play Burning Wheel I am almost exclusively in actor and not author stance. And that game doesn't use unadulterated...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    I was talking about an episode of my play, not yours. And the other posters I referred to were commenting on that episode of my play. And, as I posted, not one of them observed that the situations was one of rising action across a moral line. It doesn't even seem to have occurred to them that...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    I don't know. There have been a lot of posts about how Apocalypse World and Burning Wheel work from "trad-leaning posters", but many of those posters do seem not to have read the rules or played the games. I thought @hawkeyefan had posted fairly extensively about doing just this? I know you...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    This guy hopes his PC can kill the Orc. He rolls and is successful, and so the Orc is dead as he wanted. Or . . . This guy hopes that his PC can kill the Orc. He rolls and fails, and so the Orc survives, gets to have a turn, and kills the PC instead. How is a hope roll different? I hereby...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    This is too confused, as an account of authorship of a novel, for me to make sense of. I simply reiterate that it is possible, and indeed utterly common place, for an author to introduce an element into a story without knowing everything about its origins, it meaning, etc. Here's another...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    When I read this, I see a description of GM-driven play.
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    Yes, I know - you said he was practising components of those other spells and working on combining them to create the new spell. My point is that - as per your own post - this is not something that is actually played out at the table or even established at all. Rather, is something that you...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    I was the GM, so I can tell you why I introduced a Strange Runes Scene Distinction: because I thought it would be fun and interesting. I was the GM. I didn't decide what the runes said. The player didn't decide either; they declared an action (which included a hope as to what the runes said) and...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    As I've already posted, my friend and I can all get together and choose to raffle something that one of us owns. That would be a lottery where the participants set the stakes. It still wouldn't mean that the winner decided that they got what they wanted.
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    Given that the setting is established, especially at crucial moments and in crucial respects, by the players answering questions - about what their PCs know, remember and experience - I don't see how you can possibly say that the GM embodies the setting. If the GM were embodying the setting...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    Here's how I look at this "real life agency" thing. In real life I make some choices. But some things are thrust upon me. To mention a fairly low-stakes example, I would prefer not to have to do my laundry, but I do it nevertheless. Slightly higher stakes: I worked most of yesterday, and will...
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    D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

    Yes, as I posted already upthread, the issue is that it is high stakes. Though not only that: if I as GM had rolled on my Strange Runes table and got the 95-00 result "The runes reveal a way out of the dungeon" no one would object. It's the fact that it is player-constrained that gives rise to...
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