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    Herores of the Fallen Lands - Are Slayers underpowered?

    I agree. I was using my Knight as a reference, and for her, the smart thing to do if I wanted to perk up other skills would have been to take Melee Training (Con) and then "dump" Strength (not an 8, but maybe 12 and no bumps). That would leave the option to pump Con and Cha, which might not be...
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    Thief seems overpowered to this new/old DM

    This is one of the things I wish they would fix in the Compendium -- if you look up the Thief, it shows all of the powers and features in order, but it doesn't tell you what level you get the features at.
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    Herores of the Fallen Lands - Are Slayers underpowered?

    Maybe I'm basing my assessment too much on my own most recent campaign, where the DM has frequently treated less skillful attempts at social interaction as detrimental.
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    Herores of the Fallen Lands - Are Slayers underpowered?

    You need to go back and read the comment I was responding to. I wasn't the one who suggested a "13 in Int or Dex". That was UngeheuerLich, and I assume the reference was not to a Slayer but to a class that was not Dex-secondary. If anything, I would lean towards a Melee Training (Dexterity)...
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    Herores of the Fallen Lands - Are Slayers underpowered?

    Sure, you can do that, and it would often make sense. But some of your points above seem a bit glib. A 13 in Int or Dex is by no means enough to make for a decent Reflex defense -- it might mean a typical attacker hits Reflex on a 6 instead of a 5, but is that really worth the points? And...
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    Wild Speculation: Player's Handbook Revised

    My prediction: WotC will surprise us all by issuing a new version of Dungeons and Dragons labeled "5e". It will introduce entirely new classes taken from South Park: The Stan, The Kyle, The Kenny and The Cartman. They will fill (in order) the roles Main Guy, Foil, Patsy and Clown. The...
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    Herores of the Fallen Lands - Are Slayers underpowered?

    I guess it depends on what you are adding in -- Weapon Focus, Bracers of Mighty Striking, and a weapon with a larger than usual enhancement (say, +2 at level 4) or one that somehow grants extra damage (Radiant Weapon, Subtle Weapon). Or maybe you mean a charge build with Powerful Charge, a...
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    Herores of the Fallen Lands - Are Slayers underpowered?

    That has to be hyperbole, right? A Fullblade-wielding Slayer with Dex 10 does as much damage as a Dagger-wielding Slayer with Dex 18, assuming that you aren't talking about the Melee Training (Dexterity) build.
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    Thief seems overpowered to this new/old DM

    That's absolutely true. Aside from the at-wills Commander's Strike and Direct the Strike, the Warlord has Vengeance Is Mine and several other outstanding Encounter powers that grant attacks.
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    Herores of the Fallen Lands - Are Slayers underpowered?

    Didn't take Diplomacy, for both RP and mechanical reasons. With Cha 11 at level 16, training would bump Diplomacy up to +13, but that wouldn't be very useful in this campaign. Also, the party is full of serious Face characters. Sure, there are ways it could be "fixed", but my point was more...
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    Thief seems overpowered to this new/old DM

    How does Wolf Pack Tactics generate attacks?
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    How do you fluff a character level?

    Personally, I'm fond of the titles from the video game Fable: Chicken-Chaser and PieMaster.
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    Herores of the Fallen Lands - Are Slayers underpowered?

    If I were to play a Slayer, I would worry most about the problem that I have with my Knight right now -- virtually no ability to contribute to non-combat situations that don't involve carrying or knocking things down. It gets dreary after a while having every single NPC ignore your character...
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    Thief seems overpowered to this new/old DM

    My group may be unusual, but we average 10 to 15 rounds per encounter. Occasionally we have a really easy one that is just a few rounds, but those are almost always for the purpose of inserting a plot element, e.g. "Oooh, you killed the chieftan's grandson. He's going to be mad now."
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    Herores of the Fallen Lands - Are Slayers underpowered?

    If you are truly worried about Constitution, and don't mind starting with mechanics and building from there, you can start with pre-racial Dex 18 / Con 14 / Wis 11 (or similar), take Melee Training (Dexterity), and pump Dex and Con thereafter. Damage will be slightly lower (3 less at level 30...
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    Thief seems overpowered to this new/old DM

    Superior Will. Take it early. Take it often. Take Resilient Focus to make sure Superior Will does its job. Consider being Human in order to take Stubborn Survivor. Consider asking all of your fellow players to play Warlords, Warpriests or Paladins so they can grant you extra saving...
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    Laser cleric of Pelor power stacking issue

    Just saying it's not an automatic win button.
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    Thief seems overpowered to this new/old DM

    Could you clarify? What do you mean by that sentence, and in particular the parenthesized clause? The Thief has one protective mechanism that really isn't available to anyone else: using Sneak's Trick to become hidden when only concealment or cover is available. It's possible to attack...
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    Thief seems overpowered to this new/old DM

    That's an easy mistake to make, since other Essentials classes all get their +1 bumps at level 1, as does the non-Essentials Rogue. The adjacency requirement is a matter of debate. Quite true, but it's still an option.
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    Thief seems overpowered to this new/old DM

    Note that at paragon tier a damage-minded Thief can pull even (or ahead) for a while with MC Seeker + Primal Eye, an option that is not available to the Twin Striking Ranger (though it is to the Hunter). It does require investment in Wisdom, but pre-racial 18 Dex / 12 Con / 12 Wis / 12 Cha (or...
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