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Eh, I don't see what works against it. Ultimately gold and XP are just boring numbers. Sure, the base structure of the game expects there to be killing things and taking their stuff, but there are a ton of contexts in which this can happen. If this context is something that the players care...

Well, test, task, conflict etc doesn't mean it is against the the NPC. It is just to solve uncertainty. But I'm not sure there can be fully satisfying answer to this. Yes, building emotional connection by rolling consort and adding ticks to a lock might seem like it is missing the subtlety and...

Common ground finally! PCs in my D&D game don't have shoes either!

Why you keep repeating this non sequitur? Of course no one authored the reality of the real world! But it has objective pre-existing facts that are independent of the one trying to discern them (or at least that is the common understanding.) In a RPG the pre-authored facts take the role of this...

Indeed. The dungeon can be a real challenge, it can be a real mystery or it can be real puzzle. It however is not a real dungeon.

Doesn't matter, and I think that whole debate you're alluding to is rather pointless. But even under that logic the axioms would be the GM's pre-established facts, from which one could logically infer further facts. I think @Bedrockgames already covered this earlier.

I am not talking about feeling real I'm talking about being real! Though like I said, that certainly is a good way to make things feel real as well! Obviously. Well it seems you are working really hard to not to understand it! Mysteries can be purely mental. It is absurd to think that one...

That "realness" was the trade off. And it was a neutral but accurate description you for some reason took offence to. Indeed. If we cannot agree that words mean things it is hard to have a discussion. Not to me, and not in my experience. The Blades game I play in definitely has more...

Prime numbers, in fact, are "pre-established" in the real world.

Your actual play reports are not even remotely as illuminative as you seem to imagine them to be. They often lack crucial information about the underlying process, which is the exact thing we tend to be discussing here.

I did, but given that is was mostly just description of fictional events, rather than who decided what and when it was not particularly enlightening.

This seems like complete non sequitur. I mean reality isn't authored at all (presumably.) It however has objective existence (probably.) So that question has an objective answer that independent of the person trying to solve it. That is the same thing than GM's pre-authored facts in a context...

You can indeed use illusionism to trick players into thinking that they're solving a real mystery whilst they're not. Doesn't change the definition of "real mystery" though.

No. It was not about feeling real, it was about being real. Granted, being real is great way of making things feel real too, but that was not the point. I mean again, it is not just feeling like that, it is about being that. And if it, then that is what makes it real, because there is a real...

@deleuzian_kernel one can obviously partially solve mysteries. I don't quite see what you're getting at.

So I of course have not been present in your games, but by your description of them I do not believe this to be true. And I think games of narrativist style tend to have more collective storytelling aspects than more traddish games. Like at least how we play Blades in the Dark, it definitely has...

And whether one finds that it to be a problem or not, it would definitely put it into the "not a real mystery" category too.

However, the style of RPG play you prefer has many qualities of the latter. Indeed, such as "words mean things." People are are not having your usual semantic obscurantism.

I mean my answer would probably be to just roleplay it, but this is not the answer you seek. But certainly this can be formed as some sort of a conflict or a task? Like there is something the character wants (advance the relationship) and then there can be various outcomes for that, some more to...

They are bad at GMing? I really have not found these things to be in conflict. Yes, when we play the situation mostly operates by "living-world" paradigm, but the ingredients that I put in the situation in the first place are informed (among other things) by the character backstories and...