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Sorry I clicked "reply with quote" meant to click "reply". Nothing directed at you.

I play a monk, and as a player, if a DM decides to houserule in stun immunity, he/she had better have a good reason beyond just wanting to do it or thinking that monks are "OP". Otherwise, I'm probably not going to sit with that DM again.

Yeah it's more about attitude than it is about playstyle preferences. And I suspect that people who try to pigeonhole the other side are the very "bad apples" for their side.

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Nobody has to do anything with their character build. Do they find themselves with people that are a little better (your example exaggerates) at combat than them? Ok, RP that then. This can actually happen even if there aren't any optimizers in the group.

Unless you have bad charisma, then talking doesn't work so well either. I know some optimizers who go for this route and are good at it. Not just the stats, but good social steering tactics to avoid fights, divide enemy party loyalties, etc...

So, the mirrored image of the arcane cleric it looks like?

The only mechanical distinction I've assumed is (for a rogue usually), is if they pop out to fire an arrow from cover, do they roll with advantage from cunning action? If they rolled a high enough stealth check to beat the PP of the target, they do. Otherwise, they don't. This is independent of...

Well, there are those who underpin there playstyle preferences based on the "realism/RP" aspect. My point is that min-maxing and this aren't mutually exclusive. But yeah, if everyone's mind is already made up. It's all "Well, that's just like your opinion, man...". But not a whole lot to talk...

Agreed. Think about prior editions, and how you could swing those stats. Another way to think about it, -1 is the least amount you could have in the negative. Set the min to 10, and now everyone is forced to be at least average on everything - how realistic is that? Finally, if your "stats"...

*Shrug* Ok.

Blindsight A monster with blindsight can perceive its surroundings without relying on sight, within a specific radius. Blindsight is a substitute for perceiving things for sight requirements - agreed, but it is not a way to throw away sight requirements in the rules. It does not say that it...

So I didn't see your edit until after I posted a response. More substance now than what you had before, and I understand better where you're coming from now.

Go ahead and imply that I'm the outsider here with the rules, but until you provide reasoning for that's objectively verifiable from the text, you're not going to be convincing. I just showed that rules require a broad definition of its uses of sight/seeing to be logically consistent. Do you...

I agree with your last sentence. However, From PHB: Heavily obscured. This is darkness or heavy fog, or dense foliage. It imposes the affects of the blinded condition, which are auto failure of any check requiring sight, and advantage to attack you and disadvantage on your attacks. You're...

Another important note: If you're a rogue (and worried about sneak attack), all this is moot, since you only need to be unseen to get advantage - you don't need to be hidden. If you're worried about enemies finding you - see above. Cloak is effective against blindsight, since it specifies...

A wish for more wishes... :)

I don't agree with this. Not all desires for new classes are for flavor and theme purposes only. Cool new mechanics, or certain combos of old mechanics that you can't get (or can't easily get without having a mechanically poor char) are what make getting a new class fun and exciting for a lot of...

Agreed. This last point makes this whole thing a non-debate, because everyone can win here, whether the OP's point is true or not.

I would say that even blindsight could be hindered. Blindsight via sound? Lots of buzzing going on. Blindisight via smell? Sure smells like a lot of bugs.