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This is becoming rather surreal. I've quoted the rules - from Hub and Spokes, which can be downloaded for free from DTRPG <https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/98542/burning-wheel-gold-hub-and-spokes> - probably a dozen or more times in this thread, and probably in reply to both of you...

Didn't someone already post this upthread?

I was quoting from a rulebook. It has text that sets out its rules. But anyway, here's an example of announcing future badness: You see Plover, but he doesn't see you. He's talking to the mechanic aggressively, and you hear him say your name. The mechanic doesn't look like she's inclined to...

I haven't said that Circles is compatible with any "sim" agenda. I don't even know what your "sim" agenda is. So at one and the same time, the Circles test is wildly different, but almost the same?

Why not? You don't think that someone who is cool under pressure is more likely to be able to judge the right time to enter, based on their observations of and intuitions about the situation?

Really? Given that 99% of FRPGing takes place in an utterly amorphous world, as far as history and culture and society go, I'm not convinced by this. As my post explained, the PCs were deliberately built to permit either possibility: a swordthane or samurai; a werewolf or fox spirit; a shaman...

But for the player's action declaration - "I enter the hex" - the GM would not make anything up. Is that so? I'm not familiar with this (new, to me) bit of jargon. This is treating wish as reality. The GM might wish to have everything detailed. But they don't. When the player has their PC enter...

My own view is that part of being a skilled burglar is making your own luck - that is, having a knack (by way of observation, familiarity with how people move through and use buildings, etc) of knowing when there is someone on the other side and when there isn't. On your preferred approach, it...

High grass would be unusual in a dungeon, I think.

The earliest version of a Circles-type mechanic I know of is the Streetwise skill in Traveller (1977). Like Circles, it includes a variable difficulty to reflect the likelihood of the desired sort of person being found. The fictional flavour is different, though: Circles is about people the...

Right. Here's an example, from actual play, of success at Circles, and another of failure: The successful tests meant that Thurgon had the encounter that he was hoping for - with the ex-knight Friedrich, and then with his brother Rufus. The success on Circles didn't mean that things with Rufus...

No. They have the ability to hope to meet a person. Whether that hope is realised is determined by a dice roll.

Yes, you will meet the person your were hoping to meet. Whether they're a new contact will depend on the details of the declared action. That's right.

I don't agree that this is beyond the abilities of the PC. The PC has the ability to know people, look out for people, recognise people etc.

Speaking for myself, I find the label "narrative games" extremely unhelpful as a tool for trying to understand how any sort of RPGing works. Burning Wheel is a RPG. Like most RPGs, it requires a GM - who sets the scenes, manages the backstory, and manages pacing - and one or more players - who...

Repeatedly in this thread, posters keep asking me about examples of play I have posted from Burning Wheel. So I reply. Presumably if people didn't want my reply, they wouldn't ask the questions.

What does "sneaking up" actually mean? How are the shadows, the distracting noises, etc established? I mean, think about a children's game like Giant's Treasure: this actually depends on people looking this way or that, observing bodily movements, etc. In the fiction of D&D, those things are...

Your conclusion leaves me, again, uncertain as to what is ruled out in RPGing by this principle. I know you offered some candidates upthread, but I've lost track of them: are you able to reiterate them and explain how they don't count as diegetic on your alternative approach. Here's an example...

I think it's the character's ability rating that evaluates their ability to do something. I'm not quite sure what you see the roll of the dice as evaluating - but in circumstances where luck might play a part (does someone enter the room just as I get the door open? does a guard come and harass...

But there's always background noise - dripping water, the breathing of the hirelings, the clank of the paladin's armour, whatever it is. And smells, and shadows, and . . . It can't all be narrated. Here's another example, in the same general neighbourhood as surprise, from the "Moves Snowball"...