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Yes. Wizards do not come with innate magic. They apprentice and study for years to learn magic. This is why it is intelligence for wizards. Such a preferrence is option 1. Which is okay then if you think wizard should be a subclass of soerccer.

I have no idea what you even talk about now. No level 0. No gift for wizards. Hard work to become the class and cast spells as they do. Unless your game says wizards have a gift which makes them able to learn magic like Harry Potter, they cannot be subclass of sorcerer because sorcerers do have...

The 2 or 3 spells per level is about all casters not just sorcerers. For sorcerers to 12th level it is 2 each spell level, not less than 2 and 2 is part of 2 or 3. So nothing wrong about what I wrote. Not limiting in play at all. Idea is there, use fails. It is gone in 2024 so not an issue for...

No. A wizard must study and learn how to read, comprehend, cast, etc. from the spellbook by a teacher. That is option 2, the way it works now. This is why it makes not sense to be subclass of sorcerer. There is no gift for Wizard. If you run your game where wizards must still have a gift before...

That is option 1 yes. If the other way, sorcerer would be wizard subclass that through will force or blood has broken the link to the spellbook and no longer relies on it.

Which is good if you like that concept. My point was some people do, others don't. For persons who do not it does not work. For your take that works. But in option 2 there is no gift. You learn to cast spells as wizard through learning magic and utilizing it. Others reading wizard spellbook...

Yes, a sorcerer, but not a wizard, in the second option. The idea was to make wizard a subclass of sorcerer. Spellbooks allow greater spell access is the subclass thing. Which I feel works if you want wzards to have the gift for magic, like Harry Potter. I said if the ability to use magic is a...

I think this would work if your concept of wizard means someone must have a "gift" or talent for magic to study it. Like Harry Potter. If you go the other direction that anyone can study magic and become a wizard given the means opportunity it wouldn't make sense.

Why isn't there an option for 0?

I've yet to see that actually become an issue in play. Most players have 2-3 spells (at most) per level they really like and use often. I understand it is a good and valid point, I just wonder at its effectiveness. And I think in 2024 the new sorcerer won't even have that restriction.

I guess. I've never looked into them enough to form that idea. I guess "patch" is the word for it though. OK. I see what you mean. That would have been something if they used it across the board. These aren't checks and balances. Saying so would be like saying taking away fighter's weapons and...

But what "commonalities" are there in a mix "of psion, sorcerer, and a few other odds and ends"? What supporting mechanics did Tasha's add for sorcerers? I don't remember seeing anything. Huh? I am not following your comment here in response to my comment about metamagics going only to...

This seems like something that would make a good setting point: sorcerers are hunted like the mutant menace was, but by wizards who view their innate magic as wrong. Might be too harsh for some though.

LOL I don't feel like it has ben answered.

I never have. Do you have an example? If you mean spontaneous casting instead of Vancian, then it wasn't just the wizards, but all casters in 5E. It was a poor choice I think myself. It's a pity. Since 2024 isn't seeing a new edition, I am not expecting any real improvements, just add-ons.

Right, but what is the cost/ balance for the sorcerer, not the wizard? No problem, that makes more sense. Then does this: "the modern sorcerer is a mix of psion, sorcerer, and a few other odds and ends" mean the sorcerer lacks identity? So lack of support from WotC in the 5E sorcerer design...

The inherent gift is demonstrated in game play through spells. Spell that come from within. Innate spellcasting, right? Your description is really good. Makes me think this idea is more like a superhero than any other class. Born with special powers, exposure to magical "radiation", etc. I...

Been thinking a bunch about the sorcerer threads. Seems to me the biggest thing sorcerers need is a concrete identity? Can it only be "innate spellcasting"? It is enough? At what cost? Where is the balance? Who would play a caster that relies on magic from "outside" if a caster that relies on...

No option from Trump? ;)

I've seen similar ideas. You aren't good at Athletics because you are strong, you are strong because you're good at Athletics. That sort of thing.