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Into the Majestic Fantasy Realms: The Northern Marches pre-launch. I'm excited to announce that my third Kickstarter launches on Wednesday, May 28th, just two weeks away! Click the link below to get notified when it goes live. Into the Majestic Fantasy Realms: the Northern Marches A Sandbox...

If what I quoted doesn't explain all the nuances, then by all means, explain and show us the original text so we can verify its accuracy. At this point I am not going to accept your word that something is true about Burning Wheel without you providing proper citations.

I believe the readers of the thread now have the information to arrive at their own conclusions on the accuracy of @AlViking statement. Rather than just taking your word for it.

I want to be clear about what I have been saying, because at this point you keep insisting I am wrong while describing exactly what I am talking about. The distinction I make between character agency and meta-agency is not about players stepping outside the fiction to co-author the story. It is...

Thank You now I can answer your questions. In Burning Wheel, whether an Intent+Task is an example of character agency or meta-agency depends on whether the declared intent respects world logic. Burning Wheel prioritizes success above all. The rules are clear: a successful roll means the intent...

I believe it from Burning Wheel but somebody familiar with the system should explain it so we understand all the naunces.

The “we skedaddle” example is a player describing what their characters are doing in the moment, in response to the immediate situation. That is character agency. It’s tied directly to what is happening in the fiction and is resolved as part of play. What I am distinguishing is this: when a...

Your examples only show the declaration, which is character agency. To give a full answer I need the rules for the how the action is resolved.

You say you’re only talking about character agency, but the systems you reference, Burning Wheel, Torchbearer, and 4e D&D, rely on structured procedures that constrain the referee. These games give players control that extends beyond just acting as their characters. They also allow players to...

No, that’s not doing something as your character. Declaring goals to the referee is a player-level action. Your character doesn’t know the game has a referee. The moment you step outside the fiction to discuss intent or negotiate outcome, you’re no longer acting as the character, you’re acting...

Character Agency

Pemerton, you’ve repeatedly accused me of mischaracterizing your views. I disagree. What I’ve done is analyze your arguments using a framework I developed to clarify the distinctions you often blur or treat as interchangeable. You may not agree with how I categorize things, but that is not...

It depends on the specifics of how actions are declared. To answer I will need the specific rules in question.

yes. It is not a consequence of acting as their character. But something they are doing as a player in the campaign.

I used to think, but I remember that the point is to let the players choices drive the campaign. Not choosing or rather not being proactive, is just as much of a valid choice as any other. Some players, some groups have more fun when they place their characters under orders. Is that a...

Let’s just say I’ve noticed that the quality of roleplaying tends to drop when Charm Person or other mind control spells come into play. While I still include those spells in my Majestic Fantasy Realms, I keep this in mind when writing up their effects. I also avoid mechanics that require...

I've run into this myself, even when I worked with them on the initial context of their characters. While not 100%, I’ve found that the solution is to remember they’re not statues, but people in the setting. So eventually, someone, roleplayed by me, will interact with them. The exact situation...

So I’m throwing this into the discussion of player agency: what’s everyone’s view on the structure of Dave Arneson’s original Blackmoor campaign? Specifically, I’m referring to the earliest phase, before the creation of the Blackmoor Dungeons, where, from what I understand, there weren’t many...

As I explained upthread RPG are not games in a conventional sense. The application of game theory has limited value because there's an entire layer of agency in TTRPGs that isn’t present in most other games, specifically, what players can do solely as their characters. Thus giving rise to my...