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I think there is a code here though. 'What would make sense based on the fiction' and 'fictional coherence' are both different ways of saying 'what the GM thinks should happen'. Putting the GM in a position of privileged authorship over the setting is a perfectly legitimate way to play. People...

This is amoral

I think the question here is 'who decides?'. If your agency depends on petitioning an authority figure for a special exemption, that doesn't feel much like agency to me. If there are situations where the rules as written somehow don't suit the situation at hand (and I'm not at all sure your...

There must be a process by which the outcome of contested or uncertain actions is decided. If that process is 'apply these clear and inviolable rules, known and agreed to in advance, to determine the outcome' I have more agency than if the process is 'the game's narrator decides the outcome...

Rule 1 of 1: 'When a player wants their character to do something, flip a coin. Heads it works, tails it doesn't'. You are very welcome.

Great post, thank you.

I wasn't talking about creative agenda in a GNS sense, just agenda as is commonly understood. What's the point of play? What are we as a group of people seeking to do? It seems to me that you are unable to describe how you play beyond woolly platitudes that describe everyone's play, or...

I definitely find it interesting how 'I am impartially determining the natural consequence of your actions in a living breathing world' play always ultimately results in 'an adventure happens'. It's never 'you search for two months but nothing's there' or 'you die of dyssentry'.

'Play to learn the contents of the GM's notes', stuff like that?

To me this doesn't mean anything. You don't roleplay in combat? What is meant by roleplaying, what agenda does it pursue, what techniques does it use? Why does player background matter? I realise on this last one that you must mean character background. But again the 'natural language' you use...

I can't follow this thread without being reminded of my favourite band:

Westworld

I guess 'play to find out' is really about the GM. In a heavily story-before game, the main beats are known to the GM in advance, but probably not to the players. In heavily story-now play, no-one knows the beats in advance.

Obviously. But I think it's more likely to lead to quality and innovation than some milquetoast 'give them what we think they like' approach.

'Making a profit is innovation, art or design are not'

I own a property that was built in 2007. I have occupied it since 2015 and have redecorated. Therefore it was me, and not the architect and contractors, that built it. Ludicrous.

I understand it wasn't the point you were trying to make, I was trying to use it as a vehicle to engage the point I thought you were making, which is whether such races to the bottom are driven by actual market demand from real customers as opposed to being imposed from the top down against (or...

I think so. Presumably you've read them, in any event. Are the warhammer models I paint and convert still art if I never show them to anyone? That's pretty interesting.

I don't know what you mean by 'modern society' here. I don't think that for example diminishing standards in buidling construction are a reflection of a change in what people who want to buy houses value. They are a reflection of what standards authorities are prepared to enforce in terms of...