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I feel like a lot of these discussions tend to veer away from making D&D a better game and turn into making D&D more like a different game they like more. Going back to just four classes, or centering the gameplay around a meta-currency, dropping higher level support... this is all stuff other...

You're asking the wrong person. I don't have either of the 'Shadow of' games.

Absolutely. Like Travis said, it's way too early for them to bet the whole endeavor on their own game.

Shadow of the Weird Wizard

Candela didn't review very well and I presume hasn't set the sales charts on fire. Daggerheart has fared much better.

Kind of clickbait title/thumbnail, but the actual argument makes sense as a potential reason. Comments are basically what I'd expect. So salty and full of conspiracy theories. I'm honestly amazed at how personally people are taking this... it's almost funny, but also kind of sad.

I think it's part of the problem that every D&D edition design team has: D&D is such a broad audience that there's no agreement on what people want. 4th Edition was some players' sweet spot and others wanted to nuke it from orbit.

Wow... I knew the Revised set made the map bigger but I didn't realize it was that much bigger. IIRC the 4E version revised it again so that it was in between the two extremes.

Made a hypothetical class chart for how I'd handle the 6E fighter. Primary Ability: Strength or Dexterity Hit Point Die: D10 per Fighter level Hit Points at Level 1: Con Score + 6 Hit Points per additional Fighter Level: 6 + your Con. modifier Saving Throw Proficiencies: Strength, Constitution...

I find this a strange take. Why play a good guy in any setting if you can get more stuff being a bastard? That implies that getting stuff and being more powerful is the primary motivation of the party, which... I mean, fair, some parties it is. But if the party is motivated by heroism or a...

I can kind of see something very utilitarian like 4E Action Points or Tales of the Valiant's Luck working, but yeah, generally agreed.

White Wolf was the big competitor in the 90s, from what I've heard. They had a bigger slice of a smaller pie. But after 3E and especially after 5E the pie grew exponentially, with the majority of that growth being D&D.

That's the exact opposite of the point I was making. I was literally saying you shouldn't let the lesser evil slide! A better option? I wasn't arguing that leaving them alive should be an option. Ideally you'd have most or all of the SKs dead before Borys and Rajaat were even a factor.

That's fair. My hope is that the fight with Borys would be so taxing the party was on their last legs and finding that Rajaat had withered is a welcome anti-climax. They've done the hard part, finishing off the monster that began the cleansing wars is the victory lap. But it's definitely...

But that doesn't make them the good guys. Stalin helped out with Hitler but that doesn't mean he wasn't also a monster.

Edit: Never mind, replied to something from several pages ago by mistake.

The idea is that Borys doesn't know Rajaat has wasted away. Or maybe he noticed once but thought it might be a trick. Or perhaps he assumed it was a hallucination or false memory in his madness. Either way he wasn't going to risk it. Besides, it's his excuse for ultimate power and one thing that...

Well, primarily the endless modifiers and determining whether they stack or not. It's something I do not miss from 4E despite my nostalgia.

I think you could still get the essence of 4E without drastically changing the framework. 5E basically plays like 4E with all the tactical guts stripped out as it is, so what you'd need to do is sew them back in without all the 3E cruft and with a presentation that doesn't put people off. Edit...

That's basically my take. With the added bonus that, if my players ever managed to defeat Borys, Rajaat would appear as a withered 50 HP husk of a creature from being sealed away for eons. He's immortal but he also hasn't had a meal in 5000 years.