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But then you have to deal with players being unhappy at the DM for choosing to disallow it. For me its an issue of consistency and unity. If the core of D&D is going to be, thematically, pretty similar to how it has always been, then the Warforged would be out of sync with the rest. And its...

I understand that, and overstatement and exaggeration can work to that purpose. However some times, especially when its constant, it has the oposite effect, especially online. I assume you mean what you say. And I respond to it on that basis. Especially since almost everything you say is an...

....is one that is enjoyed by his/her player and his/her group. Sigh. I forgot to add "contribute as a wizard." I, and most people I have known/seen/read about want to be able to play a wizard, and contribute most of the time *as a wizard* as in doing magic, not throwing darts. And as I...

How much of a stretch depends entirely on the nature of the setting. The Warforged would not, in my opinion, be a good fit for any of the implied D&D settings or styles. Not as a standard player race anyway, and maybe not at all.

In Changling/Madwand a good deal of time is spent on the nature of magic. Mostly how mages percieve and use it, but also a good bit is implied about its limitations and "rules." In the Belgariad, theres a couple different forms of magic, although they are all spoken of as being aspects of the...

The Red Wizard of Thay class was specifically included in the DMG (not the PH, theres a difference) as an example to DMs of setting specific prestige classes. Remember also though that the nature of the RWOT class is such that it could easily be used under another name as a "super specialist"...

This is pretty much my feeling. The Warforged are interesting, and work well for some settings, but they don't really fit very well, IMO, in a "standard" fantasy setting. Especially not as a basic assumed player race. I also agree that they most certainly should not be included over "staple"...

You didn't miss much.

And yet you wonder why people keep telling you that you exaggerate, overstate, and use absurdly extreme examples, and come to incredibly extreme conclusions? :confused: And your assumption that the designers intend to take the exact same philosophy that they are using in the "per encounter"...

Well, since Knock can, I believe, be used at range, it pretty clearly boils down to something akin to he tells the lock to unlock and it does. But it still clashes rather powerfully with a pretty big fantasy trope. To me, the only balance issue that could at all need addressing is that...

See what I said about how in the end, people are going to play how they want to play. If a given group insists on being at 100% for every encounter, then they are going to rest/reset whatever after every encounter, regardless. Hmm....I guess you've never read Zelazny's Changling/Madwand...

This is pretty much a relative concept. And even within a single defintion of "being any good at what they do", multiple ways of achieving it will be possible. But what if the player of the wizard actually wants to contribute most of the time, rather than every once in a while? And...

This just about killed me.

The trouble I have with this, conceptually, especially in the case of Knock is that its rather unmagical. Usually when a mage uses magic to unlock a door, he doesnt pick the lock. He says the spell, gestures, and the locks unlock. Making it give bonuses to the skill means the wizard still has to...

I disagree, at least that thats all their will be too it, based on what they have said so far about 4e. What has been said, I thought, is that wizards will have their Vancian spells, but then have other magical non spell abilities some of which are per encounter, some at will, and perhaps some...

No...it isnt. The issue under discussion here is the inclusion of some degree of per day, per encounter and at will abilities to the classes in general...and to Wizards in particular. What difference does it make? The point is, even experienced individuals are still quite capable of...

One of the reasons that I like what little we know about this so far, at least as regards wizards, runs thus: One of, if not the main reason I dislike Vancian magic is because it does not fit well with most depictions of how magic works. Having the practice of magic consist entirely of...

You realize how elitist this sounds, right? Not that thats anything new here. I believe this was talking more about the whole deal of Wizards basically being useful every now and then but spending the rest of their time standing around and similar issues, not status quo adventuring...

I strongly agree with this, basically. The Core Rules should contain tools and spells apropriate to many different play styles, and that allow groups to recreate many different settings. Teleportation for example...much fantasy fiction has this sort of thing, but many stories (especially...

Holy Astral Deva, someone other than me used the word "juncture"! Sorry, I'm ok now.